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Many thanks for the pics @Descartes much appreciated! I was discussing the Henry 5a3 with Rob Page today, and he was also telling me it has the scarcer reverse (a possible crossover from class 4, making it potentially an early class 5) and has no example recorded in the Brussels hoard. He’s just put it up on his site which is rather nice! http://www.henry3.com/london---5a3.html He was also telling me that there’s a book to come before the year’s out, a shared project with a friend of his, so that’ll be on my radar.

So by making the coin blue, you improve the coin to a state of perfection? Shurely shome mishtake.

And the B-side

Nice 1863 penny - one day only - sensible offers only.

Absolutely, Stu, will do! If his website is anything to go by, he’ll be selling a lot of copies, and very likely become the new name by which we and various auction houses will categorise our/their coins! Looking forward to it!

For some reason it only posted half of my message... Congrats on your coin making it to the page - it deserves it - it's a gem!

Yes Jerry i agree and can remember someone blowing the pictures up when it was for sale and was just wondering if anyone else had any thoughts.Regardless of what die the obverse is i would never spend good money on one as would always be thinking is it or isnt it ....or have i just spent a few quid on a blocked die or Rang. Happy to have a gap for that one

Unfortunately I can't agree that the photo is in any way deceptive. The colouration of these coins (there are many more on the website), especially on the proofs, are exactly the fake colouration blue that I have unfortunately had too much experience of. Often a darker glossy blue for the currencies and a more brilliant royal blue for the copper and bronze proofs(interestingly, any lustrous areas appear less affected, still usually orange/red). Here's an interesting example that I mentioned recently to someone via a conversation: check out the Cheshire Collection/Goldberg auction 2005. This is still on the web and can be accessed via Google typing in Goldberg and Cheshire collection. Anyway, Goldberg have a good gush about Lot 3032, the 1853 copper proof halfpenny PF65BN, saying "brilliant mauve and iridescent blue toning" and ending their description with "maybe Queen Victoria herself saved this little darling"! Steady on, old chaps.... Well, I bought that exact coin from Spink Numismatic Circular in late 2001, and guess what...it was a dull orange colour, no trace of the colour it turned into a couple of years later. I sold it to a local dealer a year or so later who then sold it on, still as a dull orange proof. I can tell it's the same coin due to tiny marks and toning patterns being identical, as it was photographed (in black and white) in the original Spink Circular. The Cheshire collection's 1853 proof penny and farthing looked somewhat similar. I presume that once doctored, these coins can never be returned to their original state, so for a company to be buying up a significant number of British and Irish proofs and basically painting them irreversibly, is rather depressing. I wonder if the proverbial will hit the fan in a few years, or whether it will keep being the emperor's new clothes! Having said that, I don't disagree with Jaggy that some coins on the website are very decent and sometimes quite reasonably priced. Like everyone else, sometimes they'll have gems, sometimes turkeys.....It also helps if you can recognise the coins from previous appearances in the trade, then decide accordingly. Bottom line - be careful!

Does that mean the one with OBV 12 sold at LCA for £1500 was definately not one ? I only ask as someone must of thought it looked right

Surely they've got the decimal point in the wrong place....£23.99 is more like it!

top one is a 5g off my head and 5 c for the bottom one

Just amazed at some of the lengthy responses here, simply brilliant! welcome! My thoughts would be you need to decide what it is you like about coins first. Is it the thought of connecting with history, or do you just like pretty things? A lot of people enjoy collecting type sets of all the different monarchs? That would expose you to a) some of the cheaper coins if you start with Elizabeth and work back, and b ) give you the opportunity to start cutting your teeth on something, as you’ll likely change your collecting area a dozen times until you finally settle with something you like. As you work your way back, there will come a point where you might just want to collect one nice example coin from each monarch, could get a tad expensive otherwise. Dont forget to buy a couple of nice hammereds to see if you like them...before you finally settle down to collect pennies! Enjoy!

Crikey. Talk about a transformation. Is it trick photography or has the coin been treated?

Yes, absolutely, and this piece was gilded before the plate was cut as the edges do show - there is no doubt about this. However, I am excited about the gilt since I am surmising whether this was a piece from the "two guilt wine bowles" that are documented as being part of the "Plate delivered to Mr Edward Standishe, Alderman, by consent to be sold for the townes use and to supply their p'sent want of money...." (quoted from the minutes of a meeting of the (Newark) Corporation held on May 15, 1646 and detailed in, "The Obsidional Money of the Great Rebellion", 1907, Philip Nelson, M.D.) Obviously it is very possible that other gilt plates might have been used as well but this reference is specific right down to the fact that two gold-plated wine bowls were cut up to literally, make money. This is why I find this series so interesting - there is a tangible link with particular people caught up in a bloody struggle. Frank

Wow! They are indeed the same coin, how on earth did one become the other? Perhaps the vendor used their ‘conservation’ service! Jerry

Interesting what Jaggy says about Atlas. I used to be impressed with their coins, until I realised where some of their copper coins come from, how they've changed colour, and their mark-ups in some cases being phenomenal. For instance 1849 penny, sold DNW 12/12/17 £1700, stained on one side but reasonable coin. Now just sold by Atlas at nearly $6K and it's changed to a glossy dark blue colour! Obligingly slabbed of course by PGCS as MS63BN. It's still on the website but perhaps not for much longer. Check it out while you can. Amazingly enough it is the same coin. Also, 1825 proof penny, sold Stacks Bowers 13 January $950 Lot 20358 hammer PF63 PGCS, now "blued up" and on at nearly $6K, good old PGCS again upgraded to PF64+. Distinctive die-flaw and spot on obverse, so easy to recognise. 1805 Irish silver halfpenny, untouched thankfully, now $7,500, $1600 hammer Spink Auction 339, Lot 219 14/1/2018 There are other examples on the website currently. I don't know what other people think, but the combination of huge mark-ups in some cases on the back of chemically enhancing the coin's appearance then getting it re-slabbed and upgraded, is sharp practice in my book.

Muggins here is going to pay for their Honeymoons...Great Yarmouth in a B&B is missing from their agenda's ...I did take Mrs Peter to Kenya on honeymoon we had room 69 and the tour operator couldn't understand why on the return from Safari I requested the missionary room...I was tongue tied....Happy memories.

It's all they need to do. There are sufficient nerds around to ensure that is unlikely to slip under the radar.

Maurice Bull's Charles I Half Crowns vols. 3, 4 & 5 covers that denomination. Morrieson's articles in the BNJ cover the various mints, Lyall's Chester in the SNC, Allen's W/SA in the BNJ, Hird's work on Newark, specialist denomination volumes will have the appropriate coins. Then there is private research.

A few that have been culled to follow.

found this reference regarding the 37 crowns

Agreed. He identified mine as a pattern (on the left below - note the position of the '7' and the first 8 struck over a higher 8). A very small variation but typical of the year, which is probably why so many have gone undetected.

I never slab anything so I am unfamiliar with the issues. The 1877 I can agree their point. The 1911 maybe, but a bit harsh. The 1898 does not look particularly cleaned to me - at least not in an unpleasant way. Confirms my decision against slabbing I'm afraid!

Not quite sure what you are expecting to hear! All three coins seem pretty good and whether they were good value will depend on how much you paid! The 1911 suffers from the familiar problem with threepences of more wear on the bust than anywhere else. Might benefit from a little soap and water. The 1898 is better but does have digs in the fields on either side. The 1877, as well as more wear on the bust, has been rubbed with something abrasive to give a mass of fine hairline scratches. I would be happy with any of them, depending on the price, unless maybe I was expecting them to be Maundy? I am not good at distinguishing Maundy from not but to me only the 1898 looks possible.

This week's big spend - £2.95 BIN plus £1.50 postage. I know condition is crap but am I right in thinking F7 - raised lines on shield, rock to left of lighthouse seller's picture

As well as making sure that you have good virus protection in place (I use Avast, which is free, and seems to be pretty good) there is a useful tip that not everyone realises: If you hover the mouse pointer over a link without clicking, you should see the actual address it is linking to at the bottom of your browser. (At least that is where it appears on my Chrome browser - it may vary with others.) If the address that appears does not match what you are expecting, don't click! So if you are expecting a link to Barclays Bank and the address that appears starts ivans.bank.ru - you know what is going to happen!

Well I have achieved another upgrade to my farthing collection today, so here it is - 1882H 7+F (nothing fancy I think).

We prefer to deal in real hard currency on this forum. I don't have any trays that will accept cryptocurrency.

I was speaking with an 88 year old coin dealer earlier today and the subject of 1951 crowns was discussed. This dealer told me that he got married during the Festival of Britain celebrations in London. He explained to me the reasons for the two different colour boxes that the Crowns were issued in, Green & Magenta. The Green boxes were sold only in the Festival Hall, The Magenta boxes were sold in the Festival Pleasure Gardens on the opposite bank of the Thames.

I agree 100% with what you say, but have issues with the TPGs who won't call a spade a spade. If a coin is hairlined from cleaning, then call it hairlined. If a coin has been polished to death, then call it polished. If a coin has been cleaned without damaging the surfaces then it has still been cleaned. Just be honest, that's all I'm saying. After all, they offer a cleaning service in all but name. They also seem happy enough to slab coins that have been dipped, and more than the odd repaired coin has passed the audition.

She even looks young on the coinage. It's a form of propaganda by showing the head of state as a strong robust woman and not a frail old lady - just a slightly more subtle way of doing it than that media shot catching Putin with his top off in that Siberian river.

Here's the best one, from the Copthorne auction. Went for £7250, hammer:-

Managed to grab a day out detecting today. Had this little beaut, Not bad condition saying its been rolling around in a ploughed field.

Hey could you send me the flyer - would love to see and read the full document kingsbookshop@hotmail.com thanks in advance !

This is a table I use for my customers and myself. It is not 100% perfect between the grades but as good as I can determine. (Sheldon Scale is the 70 point grading scale that was created by American Bill Sheldon) and is what is used in the United States and around the world now. CGS Numerical Grade Average Raw UK Grade Average Standard USA Sheldon 100 FDC MS70 99 FDC MS70 98 FDC MS70 97 FDC MS70 96 FDC M69+ 95 FDC MS69 94 AFDC MS68+ 93 AFDC MS68 92 AFDC MS67+ 91 AFDC MS67 90 NFDC MS66 88 BU -NFDC MS65+ 85 Choice UNC - BU MS65 82 Choice UNC MS 64+ 80 Choice UNC MS 64 78 UNC MS 63 75 UNC or near so MS 62 70 AU MS62 65 GEF MS61 60 EF AU58 - MS60 55 NEF AU55 50 GVF AU55 45 GVF AU 53 40 VF AU 50 35 NVF XF 45 30 GF XF 40 25 GF XF35 20 F XF30 15 NF XF20 10 VG XF15 8 VG VG10 5 GOOD VG8 4 FAIR G4 3 FAIR G3 2 FAIR G2 1 FAIR G1

Big Bang has a lot to answer for. I'm absolutely certain that Sheldon had nothing to do with the scale as he certainly wouldn't cope with 11 different categories of a statement of fact, namely, uncirculated. It's one of these sort of/very/extremely unique scenarios.

This coin is impossible to photograph. Such is the unusual toning . I guess because it's just starting . Although I can clearly see the lustre the effect of the toning makes it look matt like in pictures and does no justice to the coin at all. here are 1945 Shilling scottish arms and scarcer D2121 1946 english arms

The royal mint have just announced a new set of four NEW potter 50p coins , groan What a surprise, NOT! I wonder if there is any betting at ladbrokes on these coins becomeing an annual event

wow!

unlike this piece of crap that landed on my doorstep this morning. How on earth they can make a picture look so different is beyond me. Hard to believe it's the same coin

1887 continues with the somewhat harshly treated 1+A Shilling ( I love the way it photographs though!)

Dont know if you saw /or bought this .https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Jamaica-2002-Proof-8-Coin-Set-1c-Silver-25-Dollars-Women-039-s-Hurdles-500-issued-/391949805523?hash=item5b420767d3%3Ag%3A82UAAOSwFSxaPif5&nma=true&si=HzbUnNJvllh6fzDe9ENxSPogZgc%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557 they do exist .and a bit pricey at that .

well they ain't the prettiest ever seen but £20 wasn't a bank breaker

About time we had some more posts in this thread?

With the increasing plethora of off-kilter stuff the Royal Mint is producing I have decided to restrict myself to coins from circulation only. I feel I am being taken for a mug when they bring out more and more outlandish products at exorbitant prices. I think they are in danger of "killing the goose that lays the golden egg" in the same way the Post Office has killed the First Day cover market.

Not sure how common it was, but I understand it was done to preserve lustre. If so, it's not worked in this case ! Frightening what used to be recommended for coins.

I'm all for interesting circulating commemoratives, but this continuing infantilisation of our coinage is a shame, in my opinion. I think the forthcoming 10ps will follow a similar path, yet I'm sure I'll look out for them!

Received this one yesterday. 1913 F175 Been after a nice one for ages. Terry