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This is why the varieties crop up with people looking on the internet and in boxes of low grade coins who maybe never used to bother. You only have to see a new listing for 1862 penny on ebay and it has a few viewers within minutes on every one. Unless you are a penny collector not as many would of looked at rang pennies a couple of years ago ,now more people / dealers look out for things and the reason why three 1877 narrow dates have been found just this year and that is just three that i know of.If a coin is scarce there are a lot more low grade ones to check than BU ,so a dealer may have ten nice ones a year to look at and never bothered with the low grade ones ,the chances of finding a scarce one in ten is pretty slim If there are twenty known today there will never be less and the numbers will continue to go up, for as long as people look.I use twenty as an example as below that they may well have been people looking for years and these are proven to be scarce (RARE). Even ones like 1903 open penny ,1911 Gouby x, two years ago were considered scarce ,i am not saying the buns are going to be found in those numbers but some will continue to be found every year.......even maybe today. As Jerry mentions there are more found than put on the forum and just wish it was me that could find them 😊

You couldn't ask for a nicer, more knowledgeable , more reliable, and fair dealer..... I've never been disappointed with my purchases from him......

The quote from the RM site said it was recorded as serviceable in the inventory, so that isn't speculation, but the level of wear, or rather lack of it on the punch suggests it wasn't used extensively before, or even at all after it broke. Hocking catalogued two volumes concerning the inventory of the RM archived material. Volume 1 in 1906 recorded the coins and tokens, whilst volume 2 in 1910 recorded the dies (including punches), medals and seals. This 1711 shilling has the F of FR with an unusually long bottom. The bottom right serif starts to expand as it would on an E punch, and also extends beyond the centre arm which I can't find any examples of where the F is perfectly formed. Whatever, it is not a clean punch.The question is this. Is it a defective E punch, or has the bottom been reinforced using only a fraction of a punch in the form of a partial bottom limb only of an E? It is also possible that they started with only an I punch, with all limbs added subsequently. Up to the 1700s, there is frequent use of composite letters made from a few punches which muddies the water somewhat. In the somewhat chaotic circumstances of the Civil War, there is a defective T or L(?) punch which doubles for T, L, I and the uprights of H. It's movement can be traced around the various mints, helping to establish the chronology of various issues.

Looks very useful.

Excellent points, Pete. I certainly had no idea that three new narrow date 1877's had been found this year. I know one is for sale at the September LCA - no idea whether it's on Richard's rare penny website or not. Will have to take a look. edit: Yes it is. Just recently loaded by the looks. That brings the total known number to 10 on his website. Are there any more, or has Richard netted the lot?

[in reference to this image:] I've found an image of an older portrait punch to illustrate Rob's speculation. Has helped me visualise things better. Source: Royal Mint Museum website The comments made re its continued use are illuminating.

And the 2 over 1, and the obverse 3 pairing. I agree that at the current rate of 2 or 3 publicised discoveries a year, the total VIGTORIA could well end up in the teens or low 20’s. I suspect more are found than shown on this forum. And I am still getting used to the ‘reactions’, seem to keep choosing the wrong one and having to correct the error. Sorry Mike. Jerry

It's an old one but it did make me laugh out loud when I first heard it.

Thanks @1949threepence. I've started my own catalogue here of BNJ that is searchable by author, title and subject with a direct link to the relevant article. Started at 2014, but have only gone as far back as 2007 so far.

I remember it well, Peck. Can't locate the thread, but have found the link to the BNJ archive resource - it's the same link. I distinctly remember the page layout. Can be seen here Hope you find it useful @Madness

No chance!

Visited Michael's shop when I was in the UK while he was still trading there. He accepted a GBP 50.00 that was obsolete that I had saved from a previous trip to the UK. Not sure if that relevant to his coins (which were fine) but shows he is a decent person to deal with. Also he confirmed that I has a Rev. B 1920 halfcrown when I emailed him some scans of it which again shows he is willing to help people. Hope this helps.

That's Michael Gouby, a leading light in the dealing and numismatics world. He wrote one of "bibles" on pennies - The British Bronze Penny - and what he doesn't know about coins probably isn't worth knowing! I think you can trust him!, and I'm pretty sure he has a cast-iron returns policy?