Leaderboard

Bought from Northeast Numismatics

Expanding on this theme of early strikes, a few things I have read over the years would have these early strikes looked out in a different light, although not true proofs they are referred to in several books to be select in production and therefore of similar quality to proof coinage and in some cases as 'specimen'. These coins would probably be used in gifts and for marketing showing quality and detail, most commonwealth or dependent countries had coinage struck by the Royal Mint, some independent countries did also. There are also pyx records of currency coinage undergoing the same scrutiny as proof and precious metal coinage. I would reference Pecks, and Gruber before, with regard to Copper Pennies and Halfpenny references following his listings, recorded as bronzed currency coinage, and would cite the Colin Adams collection for numerous examples. Hocking with regard reference to coinage struck for record, usually regarded as Proof. Montagu with reference to CP1857 Proof, slabbed as 'Proof like' by NGC. I am sure collectors of other denominations could come forward with examples of their own. This would then bring about the question, which is rarer, the Specimen or the Proof. 1839 Proof sets were struck on order up until the 1853 set became available, the 1839 Halfpenny is the same Obv die as used on Jersey currency coinage of that date, no currency Halfpennies were struck for the UK in that year, and maybe once initial orders had been satisfied the dies were used for that purpose. This caused 1841 Halfpenny and Penny replacing the 1839 Coppers within the sets, and for a short period, the the 1841 and 1843 Halfpennies dies were adjusted to 1839, It is possible a similar action was initiated, maybe achieved on the Penny, Bramah references a 1841 copper penny with a crescent under the 4, the beginning of an 8, or just maybe a 3.

An early, proof-like strike still deserves a premium though. Indeed, it may be more scarce than a genuine proof. So I don’t steer completely clear.

I still maintain there are many nice or "early strike" currency coins being wrongly passed as proofs, with the consequent massive uplift in cost for potential customers. I'd imagine these are a mixture of genuine error and deliberate cynical attempts to deceive. Virtually impossible to distinguish between the two, hence the fraudsters get away with it. Especially if they've also fooled NGC. My own rule of thumb is that some coins hit you in the eye as very obvious genuine proofs, as soon as you see them. I'd stick to them. Alternatively, some you know that cannot be anything other than a proof, such as the 1839 mentioned earlier, the KP31 1806 copper, bronzed copper and gilt proofs with the incomplete 0 & 1 in the date, and the R97 & R98 Taylor re-strikes with the tiny collection of rust spots at the base of the second A on the reverse. Slightest doubt, steer clear.

When that supposed 1841 No REG Colon Proof sold at London Coins in 2009 I noticed that the obverse had some interesting features, in that the top bar of both I's in VICTORIA, and DEI, were very weak to the point of being missing; also the C of VICTORIA had been repaired. It made me think that the coin was perhaps NOT a Proof. Picture below refers. I have an example with exact same features in my own collection, which I can show tomorrow if anyone wishes to see. I would also sell my coin to anyone who wants it for far less than the $6.5K that Heritage sold theirs for in 2017.....and perhaps even less than the £900 that LC sold same coin for in 2009! 🤣

Ian, I think this is an issue which faces all serious numismatists holding a collection which has assumed some considerable value over the years. Although it's more statistically likely you will pass away - for whatever medical reason - as you get older, it can happen at literally any age to anybody. Car crash, unexpected accident or unanticipated sudden severe illness. We none of us know from day to day. Thankfully, it's far more probable than not, that the worst won't happen for a good deal of time yet, and people are living much longer these days. Maybe the way round it is to prepare a numbered inventory of all your coins, with photographs and a description, perhaps in both hard copy and e form, and let a solicitor have it as part of your will. The collection to be handed to a major auction house, with the inventory, in the event of your death, and an agreement with your wife and/or other close relative to effect the transfer of the coins to the auction house. Not necessarily an easy task as collections change and are added to etc. The other potential problem we have is theft. Yes you can insure, but the monetary replacement would come nowhere near the sense of loss from having your collection stolen. Decades of work gone up in smoke, and the pleasure of viewing your collection gone.

Private sale agreed with Ian for this very nice aUNC F78. Now arrived. I must emphasise how (along with quite a few others, none of which have ever been thought of as notably rare) difficult this variety is to obtain almost in any grade, let alone this nice high grade. Thanks a lot Ian. Much appreciated. I might otherwise have been waiting a very very long time.