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.......and of course there are a number of possible different '9' fonts to add into the equation:-

I agree it's not a bad shout Richard (and Jerry). Below are the 1858/7 variations in my own collection, so there are lots of opportunities for protrusions all over the place if some of those dies are then struck with a 9 as well.

Interesting drawing- well, maybe interesting to some....

Given the large 5 was only used from 1856-59, could the last numeral be a combination of 7, 8 and 9 ?

When one talks about the possible 1858 overdates, there is an assumption that previous dies from an earlier year were reused with the final digit being altered or over-punched, i.e the 1858 over 3 is an altered die from 1853 (or, as Gouby theorises, 1852). One assumes that the Bramah 25c above also results from these dies or 1854 or even other. The problem is that the 1858 large date, 1858 over 3 and the Bramah 25c are clearly struck with the classic large date 5 with the distinctively shaped pointed top as seen below: (sorry about the different size of images) But 1853 and 1854 (and 1851) pennies, however, were struck with very differently shaped 5s, suggesting that dies from those years were NOT re-used. Unless I'm missing something ?

That reverse is scarily good - I had to count the teeth to make sure but the fake has 180 teeth whereas the genuine article has 187.

I think that is a real possibility, given that an 1858/7 die could well have remained in use into 1859, and have been in need of repair to the second ‘8’ upon which the mint worker instinctively reached for the final digit punch then in use - the ‘9’. To me it certainly looks like a ‘9’ is in the mix. Jerry

Looks like its been cleaned as well if its a farthing

No sorry its not one.

I agree Richard. The 1858/6 has the smaller numeral 5 font, but all other 1858 overdates have the 5 font which you reference as 'classic' in your first picture above. The only other years which also use that 'classic 5' font are 1856 (some PT's), 1857, 1858 and 1859. It is difficult to see, therefore, how an 1854/3 (which does of course exist), can then become an 1858/4/3, when none of the 4 different 5 fonts used in 1853 are this 'classic 5' style.

Bet they would not like scotland

I remember having quite a few banana trees when I was very young and was living in somewhere warmer climate.

Members beware! Just spotted this and already got multiple watchers... https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/196199224387?mkevt=1&mkpid=0&emsid=e11021.m43.l1120&mkcid=7&ch=osgood&euid=3bb9025c48274b559c9bab40504eb161&bu=43098541495&ut=RU&osub=-1~1&crd=20240120030846&segname=11021 Clearly one of those recent Chinese copies but which has been doctored to appear "circulated". More worrying still is if you search seller's other items he has several other Victorian copper "pennies", all copies, but all doctored to one degree or another to masquerade as something more genuine. ... and just looked at his completed listings and feedback and numerous similar doctored copies of various dates have sold for good money and buyers have left positive feedback. A fool and his money... a little knowledge... and other suitable aphorisms spring to mind. Caveat emptor!