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You need to stop this sort of thing right now !

I can only suggest that when a brockage happens, the press is full of unwanted metal which in these cases shattered one of the flans with the remnant causing what is seen. The offending item did not bind to the full flan and fell off. It doesn't look concocted in either case, as the incuse legends are approximately correct for orientation, albeit displaced significantly in the first one.

I understand how a full brockage happens, but not how a mis-shaped partial occurs. Can someone enlighten me please?

DrLarry has voluntarily left the forum, only his last comment above remains visible. Absence of Uniformity, it's not the first time you've rubbed someone up the wrong way. 👀 ___________________________________________________________ < line drawn under it.

Never a dull moment on here. Always some drama 😆

You’ve finally got some scales 😃 Taking your weight, and using the criterion from the North article below, I’d say yours is an early issue (1280-1284?) Dublin farthing - Open Es & Cs and the clear wedge-tailed R of Rex. Whilst the reverse legend is weak, it does appear to me that there are both a D and an I starting in each quarter, making it Dublin (CIVI TAS DVBL INIE). I believe the only other mint for these farthings is Waterford (CIVI TAS VATE RFOR), so you can probably rule that out in this case…I’ll let you to decide what letters you see, it’ll be so much easier for you to confirm in-hand. https://www.britnumsoc.org/publications/Digital BNJ/pdfs/1997_BNJ_67_4.pdf

Definitely just post mint damage as Chris says. I think someone back in the late 1800s actually suspected it might have been a forgery (it's not, but many were at the time) and has cut or chopped the flan to test. The metal displacement can be seen along the entire length of the cut on the top side of it (so chopped at an angle upwards from SW to NE) and subsequent circulation wear has smoothed it out a bit including blending it into the beads, and separating off the bottom serif of the I to make a big blob. Not a mint fault, I'm afraid. You're actually not far wrong when you say hit with an axe! More likely a chisel.

It's not actually a denarius as you'd think but a drachm. Here's a similar one...https://en.numista.com/235578 The legends are the giveaway with it.

So, between your coin and the others like Richard's, Paddy's, and the 49 others I looked at I didn't notice a difference in the lighthouse. Instead, the main difference was the fingers on the trident. The list of similarities I shared in my last post are identifying features between your coin and the single coin I found (1 of 50). These two appear to be the same, showing the same finger configuration and arrangement. The list of die markers possibly confirms that these two coins are from the same die. However, I don't know why the fingers look different on these two coins compared to all the rest. Could it be explained by something as simple as die wear or deterioration causing the deformed fingers seen on the majority? I don't know enough to say for sure. Hopefully, a member with more knowledge can offer some insights into the cause of this feature. Either way, I'm pleased you are happy with it!

This image shows the single coin I found out of 50 coins studied next to Citizen H coin. To further show they are the same I have circled the die characteristics seen on both coins; - Break in the linear circle just above the 1st N of Penny. - The aparent line in the exergue to the left of the 1. - The Kink in the linear circle to the left of the lighthouse and undersized teeth. - And the small die cracks shown on the teeth by Britannia's foot, between the two coins these defects are not exactly the same on both. And ofcourse the fingers on the trident.

Its hard to be sure from the images but is there a larger gap between the right hand prong of the trident and the linear circle on the 1/50 coin and Citizen H coin?

Mine matches the left hand version and @secret santa's, so I guess is the normal one:

On my own 1887 penny, her left hand index finger is also hideously deformed !

Crikey, that escalated. I'm used to seeing that kind of stuff on football forums, but never expected to see it on a coin forum. Nor hope to again.

@Citizen H when I was looking at your coin I noticed this: (The right image is your coin) There appears to be a difference in the arrangement of the fingers.

I'd say EF myself. "I can imagine loads are around in VGC being kept as a "Ooooooooooh this will be worth loads in years to come!?!" so not expecting a huge value on it...." There were certainly collectors back then, but tended to collect hammered and early milled. Even by 1926 (the date of Spink's Milled Coinage) coins of Edward VII and later were considered too modern to be of interest, and 1887 collectors or even members of the public would have put them aside purely as mementoes, no thought they would be worth anything in years to come. In that condition I'd rate it about £40+ if the colour is good (not what the photo shows).

This 1865 is on ebay listed as square colons.

Hello and Many thanks... it is a shame that its rubbed, it was the triangle lead me to Ireland the solid long cross took me to thinking Edward I, I can make out CIVI but I'm still way off with the shape of the fonts but its a learning curve 👍

No i just started looking at coins online and the 3rd coin I looked at is this example. https://dorsetcoincompany.co.uk/product/1865-bronze-halfpenny-victoria-young-head/

I'm no expert on halfpennies - I created the site in lockdown for something to do and would never suggest that it's an exhaustive source of info on halfpennies. I will add something about these colons once the position is clear.

Awesome find, 👍😀

Looks like a (post mint) scratch to me. The blob above the C is displaced metal moved aside from the rim, caused by the scratch.

Hello, I am in the midst of writing a relatively large article on the 1887 Jubilee Coinage - estimated to be about 600pgs in total. In the process of such research, I spent about a week at the Royal Mint studying about ~200 tools relevant to the coinage and a similiar number of coins. Unfortunately, it seems that the Mint did not retain the original plaster models designed by Boehm. It often had seemed to be suggested that the relevant item(s) had been destroyed - a fact that I could not bear to hear! Hopefully, continuing the research into plaster models, with some vague hope of finding something, I did come across a 2010 Baldwin's sale, auction 68, which sure enough had a plaster model of the Jubilee Head! Well, I contacted Steve Hill of Sovereign Rarities, who worked at Baldwin's who confirmed that the piece sold to a bidder in Australia, and was since resold in auction 100 of Noble Numismatics (an Australian based auction house) after failing to sell in auction 99. I am now trying to contact the owner of such a piece, though I am having difficultly identifying who may own it. Should anyone have an idea of who may own it, it would be greatly appreciated for this to be shared with me. To my knowledge, it is likely an Australian collector, perhaps someone with a focus on the Jubilee coinage. Similiarly, if anyone has any high quality images of the copper electrotype described in BNJ 1984 by Graham Dyer, please would you be able to share it with me! Kind regards, -Ashley

@SohoMint did you try Jim Noble to see if he would contact the owner on your behalf?

ah...! 🤔 it was a surf of the Google Trajan brought up "Reverse: COS V P P SPQR OPTIMO PRINC. Arabia shelf on the left, carrying branch and cinnamon sticks, at your camel feet" it didn't make much sense to me but hey, who am I to over think these things 🤷🏻‍♂️, Stuart and Paddy have been of great help to me as always, incorrectly its been referred to as a Denarius almost everywhere, Numista (many thanks Stuart) has been a great help, they have it as a Uncertain Arabian Roman city... Script in Greek....as recognised by Paddy, from the year 112. it seem to be quite high as a rarity and Silver, Its very useful to learn these things and write all this down so I can put this away and rediscover without fear of thinking what the Heck is that?? Greatly indebted to you all, so once again many thanks 🙏🏻

Thanks for the vote of confidence. I am already in regular contact with SohoMint. I nearly bought the lot but just dipped out at the last.

The goddess of Waitrose?

Yes - 'fraid so! Wallowing in the luxury of retirement now.

Has anyone come across the half penny having six strings to the harp. I believe it should only have five, the strings are also very thick possibly a double strike but looking at the rest of the harp I’m not so sure.

Yes 1656. Like you say drifted off the flan. They occasionally pop up. Stu.

The Standard Guide to Grading British Coins has been in print since 2009, initially as a colour hardback and then since 2014 as a black and white (greyscale) paperback. Some have criticised the black and white images over the years, and rightly so, but re-printing in colour was very costly and I always felt the price of the finished product was too high. But I always felt it deserved to be in colour again, so now, for the first time in about 13 years, a colour version of The Standard Guide to Grading British Coins is available. Price is £20.95 (£2 off the normal £22.95) and it can be pre-ordered here, with delivery later this month and free postage within the UK: https://coinpublications.com/product/the-standard-guide-to-grading-british-coins-colour/

I think you’re right about eBay! I bought 4 coins from that auction (2 lots), coins I’d previously sold on eBay to a buyer in Ludlow, I wonder if that was a deceased estate? Ahh, if I’d known you were there…I’m still waiting for a revised invoice to include postage, it’s the longest I’ve ever had to wait. I messaged them again, yesterday. It was a depressing auction overall for me, as I had internet issues with EE which cost me the Elizabeth Groat (lot 255) I would’ve gone £300 without hesitation. It sold for £180, gutted 😩 nb: it’s not creased, all the images of coins in capsules were the same, including the ones I previously sold, which I knew to be sound.

Just butthurt you got called out and exposed for talking rubbish about looking at 1000 coins 🤣 It's fascinating to see you preach about the obligation to welcome new collectors in one breath, and then hurl insult because someone simply offered findings of 40 coins looked at 4 examples found.

You seem to be a somewhat stupid man or women and seem limited in your understanding of the rules of statistical analysis. It's not my job to teach you even the basics of modelling estimated numbers and I have little or no desire to so. You illustrated perfectly what is fundamentally a failure of this forum. Although I'm assuming you are new to It's values you may be an accomplished collector. But you need to consider a broader purpose which is to encourage and enhance the enjoyment of a past time common to those here. Unless the environment is welcoming and fulfilling one the joy of predecimal collecting for new visitors ir retuning ones will die. To me it matters not how you choose to approach your membership but being an ignorant stupid person only you have to live with. Your methodology is as flawed as your personality.