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Well Done again! If I was you I would buy a national lottery ticket, about the same odds!

On a relatively high grade penny like that, the H would show strongly. What you've got there is a ghostly anomaly, and I'd agree - no H

Definitely NOT an H. As you can see from Secret Santa's post above too, the H if present is smaller than the smudge/toning/anomaly you have where the H would be. Many times we all wish the presence of something and convince ourselves from a humble picture that a smudge or blob just might be the magic thing! I myself must have bought over the years half a dozen 1863 pennies with "something" perhaps below the date which just might possibly have been a die number with a fair wind behind. Needless to say of course, none of them were!!

I can’t see an H either. I think there may be a blemish in there that the brain may try to interpret as something meaningful, especially if one is looking for it. Like the image of Jesus in a slice of toast or an alien face on Mars.

Blimey, I’m out of this one…where does it stop?

Having dismissed the H as an anomaly, I might have to revise my opinion as I saw the face of Jesus on my slice of toast this morning...

I am delighted to share with you my most recent discovery ! I still cant believe it. I search to the point I literally become so sick and tired and just as I'm about to have a break as I cant take no more....... I find something like this, then the motivation is completely replenished. £16 with postage.... I feel a bit bad if im honest, I wouldnt call the seller a dealer but looking at the inventory not sure how they missed this one. I have only included part image of the coin as I would like to let the dust settle, I dont want the UK seller to get wind of it. In time I will share the complete coin.

They’re going to ruin that 100% positive feedback with that 😆

That's an amazing stroke of luck to find an Freeman 90 unattributed. I've been collecting for twenty years and have made some fantastic finds , but have never seen an F90 for sale any where other than in a specialist auction . I have though had the luck back in January to find an 1897 F148 in AU condition after searching all that time. Examples turn up but normally in poor condition . My example is pictured below. But good luck with your quest to find an example of all Victoria pennies as some are thought to be unique , such as the F19 1861 2+F

Come back Dr Larry, all is forgiven!

Both of these are examples of classic pareidolia !!

I have found (so far) 2x 1835, 1x 1839, 1x, 1842, 4x,1843 (I read that this date is the most common with over dates as well, but none of mine are, I think it was 43 over 34?!?!) 1x, 1862... I had these in with Victorian Maundy one pence coins car boot find, I still had the cash bag from Midlands Bank that they came in... miss them days. 🥲

or not there

You will have difficulty finding any die detail specific to the Heaton mint other than the letter ‘H’ as the working dies were prepared at the Royal Mint from their master dies and sent to Birmingham for striking. The Heaton mint did not develop their own dies. And don’t confuse differences due to die wear, depth of strike, clashed dies etc as differing varieties. It’s a potential minefield. Jerry

Great Collections has responded to me, and accolades to them for being receptive and ethical.

I would say it's an F82. The figure 5 is more upright on the 1875H.

FWIW I don’t think it’s an H, just an anomaly of toning and surface metal. The big issue is, if you’re going to call that an H, you then have to have an explanation for the Triangular shape that’s hovering between the digits?

Images, photos, etc, can be deceptive and not necessarily deliberately. The best determinant is studying the coin in hand.

Im going to study the 1875 and 1875 H there must be an identifiable die characteristic unique to the H coins. Lets see.

Thank you both for the orders. wlewisiii, I'll sort you out with a PDF of the Irish book over email.

Can also clearly see the 'WRL' on the reverse. Westair Reproductions Ltd, I think. They make replicas for museum gift shops etc and they always have WRL stamped on them.

For me the new posts are at the top, below any ‘sticky’ posts so it must be possible. Or you can always click ‘unread posts’ top right. Jerry

Did you order via: https://coinpublications.com/product/the-bronze-coinage-of-great-britain-freeman/ If so, it'll be reasonably fast. I have a few in Germany that I use to fulfil international orders, as postage is much cheaper from here. The UK warehouse has 2 or 3 left at the moment and I just ordered a small re-print yesterday, so with any luck no one will notice the gap.

I have added the F90 to my website - let me know if you would like a personal attribution.

Ah ! So prompted by Paddy I delved back into a box of duplicates, high grades & oddities that are to good to part with, I wasn't sure if I had any variations of the 1887 Shilling, I don't have the young head, only the second portrait.....none in the duplicate box...aha I did find another 1872 this one has the Die No 29....Memo: this was kept as at some point you could be assed to move the coins to create a space so Die No 29 will slot in with the other 1872.....!?!? it also has a deformed N in Britanniar .... ....Yes a Rabbit Hole...but its a ocd world I seem to be living in.... 😟

What the heck, Im just going to share it ! So pleased it's the reverse which is in better condition. I know on these rarities grade is kind of irrelevant but what is your opinion please? Thanks

Using a bain-marie and a thermometer. The temperature fluctuated between 85 and 95°C.

Thank heaven the vendor confirms that it is genuine, not a replica! I rest assured 😄. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/198243354927?_skw=hammered&itmmeta=01KN2QEJGWGHJW8JGVRHXGCNZK&hash=item2e2839892f:g:EjYAAeSwwP5pzBu5&itmprp=enc%3AAQALAAAA8GfYFPkwiKCW4ZNSs2u11xCdMdsLZrzlKxQyLy1byZLX53r1elvuJN%2FF39HjSTeEV6eWM8XGXpL0nqXXF2nnpzem946gkjE36Mqqfd%2FcS%2FY04ocGPDJeJHJTgnZZRWylpSn3UcChX1ZfxgnWVN0cucnA4xdSNuaHzpYUrwuRDjrkDQveuTwjgPZTedsF7la4rPTS5YtWSWqxbPAxvxFqI824RBtL8fvyDZrLL5rlJgQl%2FHSHTi3ISEmZV2bPtZ5l17h3SfKg%2BBD9rdJz%2Fx44Kdm9o0hbtItqnP5YB%2FWs3MuUlSAXLUKm7Xq9x5WiQnvyig%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR4aputeoZw Jerry

You might see a flying orange flying man-baby in london complaining about us being late for the third world war (well they were late for the first two weren't they?)

so finding this whilst sifting through the hoard and thought it worth a mention being that its in a good condition and ask for an opinion of its grade... however...! on closure inspection and magnifying the photo it looks like it was struck with a cracked die..... 👍 don't know about you ....its a real treat (for me) to find these faults...😁

Its just a F82 for me.

Its one of the most mis attributed types you see , nearly all the so could high tide examples on E.bay are incorrect . The best way to tell is by the stem of the P in Penny which on the High Tide points to the Gap [space] between the teeth, on all the others it points to the Tooth.

Agreed; not high tide.

I am no expert on these but by comparing with @secret santa's site I would agree, this is not High tide. I see there is a link on the PCGS page to report errors - is that worth a try?

I decided to order it today from your link because of this post Now I just need the other one and I'll have two really nice references!

Thanks for that. I just checked and it seems that the posts are now showing new posts first. I must have clicked something I shouldn't have. Thank you.

It's not really a paperback - it's A4 pages held in a ring binder.

You mention dealers listing the coin in error, in my spreadsheet I have this image which I made which may help you id the type in poor condition and or poor photos in the sellers listing

Congrats. That's a great win. I have similarly been spending hours over several years looking for some varieties, such as high tide 1897 penny. With those, even some attributed (in TPG slabs) are incorrect, let alone dozens of dealers who list it as such, erroneously. With so many bad listings of it, I feel even less likely to find an actual one unattributed. But I keep looking, in madness, haha. I may break down and buy a correctly identified one, even with the markup. I feel aside from maybe 1902, most of the rarer tide variants will just be too tough to acquire, otherwise, esp where I am located.

I would like to try find one example of every known variety. In 3 months I have found two of the rarer coins in the list, I have accepted I may have to purchase a few attributed types but the more I find the more I'm obliged to continue with this challenge. Its unlikely but lets say I did compile a collection of all the known varieties for the bun head penny series. Do people auction complete collections? I plan to invest in books. Does anyone have any books for sale please which may be of use to me.

This experiment was with 5% sesquicarbonate at room temperature for 6 hours. The green spots have gone but the coin looks stripped and cleaned. I'm going to try 2% at room temperature with a shorter contact time.

I enjoy having huge silver coins in my pocket so I added a new one to my “pocket coins” today: a 1971 S proof Eisenhower 40% silver one dollar. It looks fun alongside my 1935 Peace Dollar and 1935 Rocking Horse Crown from the UK. My son was “Oooh! Shiny!” and, yeah, proof coins are cool that way. To protect them I do keep them in encapsulated so that they don’t get scruffed and dinged in my pocket like other circulation coins. Fun stuff

I would use WD40. Give it a good soaking and it will just lift away.

Olive oil classically treats verdigris, without damaging the rest of the coin, so maybe it will soften and loosen the tape glue, agian without doing any real harm. On the other hand, if the tape has been stuck on for a while, it is possible that it has already damaged the surface, and removal will simply show this up. You pays your money and .......

1861 Freeman 28 5+G Managed to pick this one up recently , in not to bad a condition and its an upgrade for me . A devil of type to find in high grade !!! 😊

Some small coins that I've been checking this afternoon 🙂 we have an 1817 sixpence, an 1843 fourpence, a 1912 threepence and an 1876 third farthing. I think they're all pretty decent grade wise; the photos are okay but not amazing 😅.

I really did not want to weigh in anymore on this subject inasmuch as my purchasing and returning the coin speaks for itself..... However, I think some of the focus is being lost, although Bob C. (RLC35) has made an attempt to place this subject back on track.... The question is, as I see it, "Is the coin an Mule (TB/BB) or not... As the Royal Mint used ONLY Round Beaded Border reverse or Toothed Beaded Border reverse, and at NO time ever used a PARTIALLY BEADED BORDER reverse, the question to be answered is which variety this is.... Creating a NEW name of a reverse to address a specific situation does NOT resolve this question. Calling a duck a swan, does not make it so. In the interest of full disclosure, I believe there has been a recent discovery of a Mule (TB/BB) struck with an Obverse 3 die (instead of the documented Obverse 2), but with the same Reverse A... As the question regarding THIS coin involves the REVERSE, the subject is moot. This coin needs to be examined without the slab, by someone who specializes in this subject, and whose expertise is uninmpeachable. (Michael Freeman has been suggested, and as a impartial observer whose book is considered the BIBLE of Bronze coinage, is an excellent choice), If indeed, after the coin is examined, the determination is that the coin IS a mule, as PCGS has certified on two occasions, then the coin MUST be accepted as such by all, with apologies in order to the OWNER/SELLER and to PCGS..... More importantly, to both the current owner and/or any potential buyer; should, after EXPERT examination, the determination be that the coin is NOT the certified variety; WILL PCGS GUARANTEE THE COIN AND PURCHASE IT BACK????? If PCGS stands by its current assessment of the coin (certified as a MULE TB/BB) and an interested party purchases the coin and has it examined by ACKNOWLEDGED & RESPECTED EXPERTS (such as Michael Freeman, the staff of Colin Cooke, the British Museum, the Royal Mint, etc), and their determination is that the coin is NOT the certified variety; WILL PCGS GUARANTEE THE COIN AND PURCHASE IT BACK????? It all boils down to whether PCGS will guarantee 100% that this coin IS a TB/BB mule, or will PCGS attempt to create a NEW variety, "Toothed / PARTIAL Beaded Border", a variety that does not exist and was never struck, to explain something that is most likely merely the result of as worn die...... A decision that would be viewed as a "cop-out" or evading the issue by most collectors, and would not instill confidence in the numismatic community. Another question arises as a result of the dispute regarding this coin. Inasmuch as a severe doubt has been placed upon the accuracy of this certification and has therefore hindered the sale of an EXTREMELY RARE COIN IN EXCEPTIONALLY CHOICE CONDITION: Will PCGS arrange for an EXPERT ( or EXPERTS), knowledgeable in this series, impartial to the controversy, whose determination would be unimpeachable, to examine this coin, outside of the slab, AND to accept his/her/their decision as absolute??? And, should that determination be that the coin is NOT as certified, will PCGS stand by its GUARANTEE and purchase the coin back from the owner at its fair market value??? Or will PCGS stand behind its Grade Designation (not in question or disputed) and claim that the INCORRECT VARIETY designation was a "Clerical Error"??? Another decision that would be viewed as a "cop-out" and would not instill confidence in the numismatic community. At this juncture, I believe the time is right and the neccessity exists for PCGS to state, in public, in UNEQUIVOCAL and UNAMBIGUOUS terms, exactly what its guarantee is regarding this coin, so as to provide, ANY and ALL, past, present, and future owners of this coin the peace of mind that their investment in a RARE coin is secure as to designation......

Ron, It is always encouraging to see personal representation especially from a large company like yourselves, and it really is a move to be commended. I can appreciate your comments about the "toothed/beaded" border designation, and the fact that it is not immediately clear, but the two different reverses that the major references class as toothed or beaded do have differences. When looking at a number of these farthings, it does become clearly apparent that a coin is either the toothed or beaded variety, even down to grades as low as fine. Historically in literature this has always been defined by the 3 rocks to the left of the lighthouse instead of the large single rock that appears, although as we all know only too well, coins do come to light that differ from the "norm" and hence become a new variety. The fact that new varieties are identified regularly further compounds the fact that the "3 rocks" factor is not a 100% guarantee that a coin can be classed as a Beaded Border. I have no doubt that there could well be a beaded border reverse out there with a single rock waiting to be discovered. I have provided an image comparing the beaded and toothed borders on several coins at various grades, and I think the difference is readily apparent, not only in the shape of the denticles/beads, which are consistent around the perimeter, but also when considering a section through the coin. Comparison Section The problem is that if I was purchasing a BB/TB mule, I would want to see this feature to determine that my investment was not at risk, unless I was 100% certain that it was a new variety. I also expect that many people would feel the same. However many other investors may not be aware of such distinguishing features and would want to choose the slabbed option, safe in the knowledge that an expert has authenticated the variety. As you say if there is a portion of the toothed border that has deteriorated to show beads then your description may well be accurate, but I would also suggest that it could be misleading to the buyer who may not be getting what they expect. I am not stating that the coin in question does not show a mix of beads and teeth, because without the coin in hand it would be difficult to be certain, and the fact remains it may well be a new variety. However my personal opinion was that it did not match what "historically" has been defined as a BB/TB Mule, and should ideally therefore not be labelled as such to avoid confusion similar to that which has already occurred. If the coin in question has mix of beaded and toothed on the reverse and toothed on the obverse, would it not be better labelled as a beaded & toothed obv/toothed rev mule, I can appreciate its a bit of a mouthful and could probably be better worded, but at least it is an accurate reflection of the coin in the holder. Fixed Link!! Comparison

I sent him a note, when I saw he had purchased the Mule. Bob C.

Josie, I know how you feel, I was really unsure about what to do with this item. Do you ignore it and let people bid on something that is not what it appears to be with the view that it is buyer beware. The problem with that is that it is a lot of money for someone to invest into something when it is not what it seems. I sympathise with the seller because they are stuck with the item and the error is not theirs. I sent a polite e-mail to the seller stating my view and explaining the features that are found on a beaded border reverse and referred them to the coins in Colin Cookes collection and the comparisons on my site. I even offered to put something in writing if they did want to take the issue up with the grading company. I am not interested in trying to bad mouth sellers and I have no problems with this seller who has been courteous and efficient in their response throughout the process, and I have to admit if I was in their position I would probably treat my e-mail with a bit of suspicion and would want to check it out before deciding what to do, but I feel as a member of the numismatic community that I should advise people of my opinion. I also would not put this opinion forward unless I was sure of my comments.