Leaderboard

Found the others today....A fair devil indeed....

You'd need a deep pocket for most of these recent items at Heritage, but not all early copper has sky-rocketed over the last few years - the slab-grades have the main effect of course. There are two Peck plate coins, but none of the coins including theses were provenanced by Heritage. Perhaps the buyers recognised them too, but probably just going on the grades. All are hammer prices: 1694 1/2d - MS61 - $1200. Surprisingly low grade for a coin that retains lustre, this is the Nicholson example that sold for £1,200 (I think) in 2004, if so it's made no money at all over the last 20+ years! This is the exception price-wise. 1694 1/4d - MS64RB - $7,000. Lovely colour though slightly porous detail, this is Colin Cooke's own example sold 2005. 1695 1/2d - MS63 - $9,000 - big rise on this one, though it has been glossed and lost some lustre since previously sold at Baldwin's 2010 Strickland-Neville Rolfe auction. I saw it at the time and wondered if it was thick-flan (there's only one known otherwise) as it did look unusually thick. It was a bit porous though so that can be deceptive. Unfortunately it was sealed in plastic and I couldn't ask Baldwins to weigh it, because if it was heavy weight, they'd have amended the description and it wouldn't have been a bargain! It wasn't very cleanly struck though and It went for £540 back then. 1699 1/4d date in legend - MS64 - $7,000. This is Brook's example and is the Peck Plate coin despite the dark photograph where you had to squint to make out much. The edge variation matched up and it is of course the no-stop between A and the date variety - which was also not mentioned by Heritage. As far as I know, this was last sold in the Shuttleworth collection SNC 2001 as EF £650. 1701 1/2d - MS63 - $7,250. Also the Peck plate coin and Heritage auctions missed (or the slabbers couldn't be bothered to note) it was no stops obverse (P.704). This is ex Nicholson Hopetown House, Peck.

Those prices are quite astonishing. I have Peck's own 636 plate coin (Montagu 3); so now may be a good time to sell.

You were 100% correct Stu and thanks unwillingly numismatist for putting me on to Liz who verified it was a fantasy piece unfortunately 😕 Thanks guys this is much appreciated because it's irked me for some time. Glad it was in a joblot of coins auction and as it hardly cost anything.

1882 were nearly all minted by Heatons and therefore carry the H - a few were minted in London (just to test the new electronic presses?) and are very rare. I'm baffled by the George III coins though - pennies weren't minted until 1797, "cartwheel" type. There's no 1773 or 1775 pennies, but there were halfpennies which are noticeably smaller than bun pennies unlike your 1773. The 1775 looks very wrong and is probably an 'evasion' type, i.e. a contemporary forgery produced in the US. The 1773 "penny" looks more like a genuine halfpenny should apart from the size , but is also probably wrong - REX is wider spaced than on a genuine example.

Yes, definitely a contemporary forgery (very common) of a silver skin clad onto a base metal core - the core is corroding and bursting through in places which is causing those greyer-looking patches and random protrusions through the silver skin. So, no scrap value at all to speak of, but an interesting bit of social history and probably worth keeping thus.

Seemed as good a place as any as bought the Halfpenny from the last LCA with obverse 1.

Great. Message me and we'll sort out the technicalities.

That's sad. I lost my mum to a brain tumour in 2021. By the time she was diagnosed it was stage 4. Three months she lived from diagnosis to passing away. Affected us all deeply. Thank you for replying. I look forward to seeing your future research when you are publishing your findings. Stu.

Poor Gary, but absolutely fantastic that you’re still around and working with the counterfeit coinage. Nice to hear from you.

Hi Guys! I'm still around but haven't had much time for coin study lately. Gary was about to start a new cancer treatment which unfortunately proved to be in vain. As he knew he might not be recovering, he offered me to buy his collection of counterfeit George IIIs shillings at a very fair price. So I jumped on a plane and spend a pleasant evening with him where we wrapped the coins in rolls with paper and looked at some of his vast collection. Next morning the very day he would start the new treatment, I returned to Denmark - and never heard from him again. I haven't yet had a chance to look at the coins, of which there are apparently over a thousand. Instead, I've been working with my own collection in the hope of being able to refine the group divisions and perhaps arrive at a more correct classification for the whole series. Only when that's finished, I will start classifying Gary's coins.

I believe their local council is to rename Wells-next-the-Sea as Wells-in-the-Sea?

Again another opinion required in regards to a worn out William III Half Crown, 16_ _ , Chester Mint ? Large Shield its very rubbed but looks like is lived in the ground, ..... is it Scrap or worth keeping? Many thanks "H"

Whilst flicking through the Royal Mint Museum collection I noticed that they have two of these that may as well be shared here for reference, RMM 2590 and RMM 2591:

Keep an eye on the Items For Sale topic, I have scruffy crowns and some scruffy other stuff plus nicer coins that I'll be offering here soon.

I'm afraid that this coin is basically just scrap - 1723 SSC is a very common piece (unless it is one of the rare varieties like French arms at date or C over SS in the third quarter, which this isn't) and pieces in much better condition don't cost the Earth. With the recent rise in scrap price, yours would be worth way more as a lump of silver than its recent "collector" or "book" value for a coin so poor (and I doubt anybody would want to buy it as a coin to collect), so, sadly, scrap it and put the money towards buying a better piece, be it a nicer one of these, or anything else that takes your fancy.

Oh yes, I see it. That's a classic die crack/flaw.

First, the As : do be aware that the legend on farthings is very small so the serifs on - e.g. - a letter A will tend to join together after very little wear. This is quite normal. As for the NIA line, I'm not seeing it - can you post a larger reverse picture please?

Sad to hear it's a fantasy piece, but also good to know to watch out for them.

Do you want a new place for it? It's such a shame that the pics are not available on the internet archive. My hosting provider doesn't charge me at all for low volume websites. I have a couple of small hobby websites of my own and also host for others (e.g. my friend Steve's https://www.thefakepoundcoindatabase.co.uk). There would be no charge of course!

Yes, the Steppeulvene page was mine - It just got to expensive to continue with it. Gary thought that I should have it, since I worked out a useful system of separating the main groups. I'm grateful that I got the chance to buy his collection and hope I can take the next step (which is a throughout study of the punches) later this year.

Welcome back @seuk. I am sorry to hear about Gary, though I did not know him. He made a wise and altruistic decision in passing on his collection intact before he passed. Is/was the website I linked to above yours or his? Is it likely that it will ever be resurrected? It was a wonderful and powerful addition to our knowledge of counterfeit coins.

Americans love the 'evasions' so would possibly snap up the 1775? As for the 1773, it's worth keeping - I've never seen anything that size before, so even if a fake it's got great novelty value! The 1882H is nice enough to keep though only worth a few £.

No problem.It was only afterwards when i was looking at it thinking how's it been made it dawned on me that it looks like it was soldered on. It looks like the right arm on the figure has fallen off and possibly the E on that side as well or not enough solder was used and it just smudged the E. That would explain why it's unique as it's literally been handmade by someone. I doubt you could make another even similar without adding or losing bits. It's something to be on the look out for in the future. I have seen similar work on fake stycas. Usually though with them they go back to bare metal when you plunge them in acetone as the patina is painted on them. Stu.

Is it just me or does the design & lettering look like it was applied using a soldering iron ? Strange blobs where the metal has been applied then smeared / spread out ? Stu.

Liz is the one i meant when i said chris rudd. She's running his website & sales. She will do free evaluations for people. Get in touch with her and let us know her verdict. Sorry to sound sceptical but i often see fake coins with unusual pairings for sale on ebay. It's a common theme done on purpose so you cannot compare the coin to an original to pick out the differences. I see it quite often with fake styca & sceatta. Anyway good luck and keep us posted.

Hi Stu The weight of it is 1.9 grams and is about 15mm wide bud

or liz@celticcoins.com - She'll be a good resource on it too. EDIT: I'm going to sit on the fence with the caveat: I think it should be properly appraised by a professional. If the internet cannot provide a similar example, it's either a contemporary forgery or real. It looks struck, not cast and that would entail quite a lot of work in order to produce a fake which would not have any intrinsic or implied value without any solid provenance. It is not impossible for it to be a new discovery. Good luck.

Even if one-pees are ever removed from circulation, the RM won't miss an opportunity to milk them for as long as possible, minting BU as normal and as many other 1p novelty types as they can possibly sell - probably long after actual money itself becomes just a novelty... merely old fashioned gift vouchers/tokens to hand to people on special occasions and for use by people who refuse to let go. I'm a fan of actual cash, I think over here in Germany cash is probably more widely used than in the UK. In the end people will always go with what is most convenient, they don't really care . Apart from criminals, they'll all have to switch to crypto! I don't remember shillings either. Or technically I suppose I do, because they were still in use in the 80s as 5p. I bet retaining the shilling name (and multiples thereof) would have worked perfectly fine if they were dual 5p/shillings from the start. In fact even in the 70s when the 1p/2p still had useful spending power, they probably would have known they would eventually be phased out just like the half-pee was. In fact, the 1p removal from circ (but not existence) is probably long overdue. How about re-valuing a new £1 at £10 old-decimal fv, made up of 20 new-shillings (equiv of 50p each) and a new new penny at 100th of a new £1, i.e. 10p in old-decimal. Yeah, that would work and wouldn't be confusing at all 😑

I think the penny has already lost much its dignity when the RM started making them with copper plated steel. Even then, it costs more than it's face value to produce. I agree the penny coin is hugely symbolic but perhaps it is better to retire it soon rather letting it drag on.

I personally think it is fake. Each side is from a different coin which should be gold. I can't find anything like it in Spink or Van Ardsell. I think it's a fantasy piece. One side appears to be similar to the one linked above by Peckris and one side is trying to be this but doing a bad job in my opinion. https://en.numista.com/459267

Here is a gold coin with a similar obverse: https://www.baldwin.co.uk/product/atrebates-regini-eppillus-gold-quarter-stater/ I'm afraid my knowledge of these is almost zero.

When I visited Wales many years ago, I came across an area where cafes and small shops gave prices in today's money and also the prices in ca 1900. If you want to, you can change your modern money into counterstamped Victorian / Edwardian pennies and use these in the cafes. This allows visitors to spend old money.

Manchester and Birmingham house prices will soon be the hot ticket, as the peripheries of the UK slowly slide into the sea!

Yes i saw the canal one. Bad the way that barge went down like the Titanic. You been watching the ROC post in Tunstall on the East Yorkshire coast as it slowly eroded out the cliff's and fell on to the beach ?

My idea a few years ago was to do away with the 1p and 2p because they are comparatively expensive to make and fiddly to deal with, and have the 5p as the smallest denomination in regular use, as is already the case in some countries (I think NZ and Australia have 5c as their smallest in-use coin). But with a just-for-fun and British quirky twist - have it renamed as a 'Shilling' (dually featuring both '5' and 'Shilling' in the design). Items could then be priced in Pounds and Shillings if so desired, but it would still be decimal and technically nothing would change, there would still be 100 pennies in a pound and the 5p would still be 1/20th of a pound just like it and the shilling always were. Merchants could price exactly the same as now, e.g. £3.40 or they could be brave and price as £3/8 for the novelty value. Most would no doubt stick to the way it is now, but it would be fun to have pounds and shillings, and perhaps shillings could catch on at least colloquially. The 10p could be called a florin and the 20p a double florin. The 50p would be 10 shillings, obviously. I think it would be fun thing, but it's no doubt too late to re-establish any kind of shilling now, even in name only, for 2 reasons - 1. People who fondly remember using actual shillings are becoming scarcer so there really isn't much nostalgic connection with shillings, florins etc among the general public as a whole and the concept of having £1 made up of 20 of something would be confusing for many. And.. 2. Physical cash in everyday use for payment of most things is being overtaken by electronic alternatives, so use of actual cash is dwindling and is very likely to continue on a downward trend. Pie in the sky. Maybe it could have worked 20 or 30 years ago!

Yep,