mint_mark

So anyway, back to the catalogues I wasn't very impressed with the 2003 edition of K&M... I have noticed missing sections and sections in the wrong place... like the editing and layout was very hurried. The previous 2002 edition seemed much more "finished" in this respect. Any comments about 2004? I also have the Krause German catalogue, which isn't really worth it unless you need the pre 1800 stuff... there is no more detail than the world catalogues. Also, my copy suffers from a printing error (about 100 pages missing). Finally, I was surprised to find in my local Waterstones a book dedicated to identifying and valuing Chinese Cash coins. Not what I was looking for, but interesting to see.

Blimey! I wasn't even looking for 2004 yet!! Better keep my eyes open... As for minting lower denominations in huge numbers... isn't that what they did in 1967 to get some time off for preparing for decimlaisation? Maybe they know something we don't?

I just use the two Krause and MIshler catalogues that cover 1800 to the present day. That covers the vast majority of colonial coinage... and you get the rest of the world for free They go into some areas in lots of detail (like India for example), but I don't know if there's a lot missed out too.

And another thing.... while we're talking about circulating coins Coin Yearbook 2004 has two entries for most modern coins, the "ordinary" entry and the "unc" or "BU" entry with a slightly higher price. A note explains that unc or BU coins may come from presentation folders or sets. So, is it possible to distinguish between these coins just by examining them? Or do you only know for sure if you remove it from the set yourself? When the specimen sets started (1982?) I think the mint said that the coins were specially selected from those struck for circulation... is this still true? Or do they strike coins more carefully for the sets now?

Glad I'm not the only one who collects coins from change I saw quite a few DNA £2 at the end of last year, and the Marconi ones before that, but hardly any of the commonwealth games issue. I never find a choice BU £2... even if there is no wear there are hideous bagmarks, and even if there are no bagmarks you seem to get striations at the edge of the centre part of the coin. Also, I've only found one Suffragettes 50p, and 2003 50p and 10p seem generally thin on the ground... Chris! There's a small market for decimal odds and ends... we have a few gaps to fill Back on topic... this is pretty much how I started coin collecting. I built a complete set of shillings and florins 1947 to 1967 from change! The 1959 Scottish was given to me as change in a pub to complete the set

Well I'd be nervous paying for a 1934 Crown too! So, did someone phone in to ask about one or have you just bought one yourself? (goes off to check the crown section on predeciml.com... ) Nope, still no wreath crowns there

My main problem with the current coins is that the smaller obverses don't seem to be very well defined. Try and grade 1p, 5p or 20p coins... it's like there is hardly any detail to start with! And another thing! The high gloss finish that the mint uses scuffs as soon as you look at it and new coins very quickly gain a sort of milky appearance. It's so hard to find a choice BU example in your change you'd almost think it was a deliberate ploy to make you buy the sets :)

Best George III coin with a ship on it that I can think of is a Bahamas penny... a sailing ship sailing to the right. I think Bermuda had a similar (earlier) coin sailing to the left.

They did do quite a nice catalogue didn't they?

Yes, but it's an interesting digression I realise we've had a token coinage for a long time... what I meant was the 20th century saw the last traces of the intrinsic approach disappearing with the removal of all precious metals and the fixed links between currencies and gold being abandoned. I haven't studied the economics of the time in detail, but I have thought about how money must have worked back then. I understand that in Victorian Britain there was virtually no inflation, which I imagine is a consequence of the money supply being limited by the supply of gold and silver... these presumably being imported from the empire and controlled by the government. Even earlier I have read that problems were caused a couple of times when rich new deposits of silver were discovered in South America... an increase in the money supply means that there are more coins to represent the same amount of wealth, so prices go up. At other times the opposite must have happened... not enough new precious metal to keep up with the growing wealth of a booming economy, so we had debasement and tokens (and falling prices?) You mentioned the cartwheels... they got melted when the copper was worth more than the face value. I thought the 1799 and 1806 coins were also intended to be intrinsic (higher copper price, smaller coins) but I'm not certain. You can imagine the price of copper must have fluctuated a lot back then with the industrial revolution in full swing and new inventions and metal working processes being discovered all the time. Does it follow that the material used for the currency should have no other use? Or that you should just stamp it with weight and fineness (South American style) and let the face value fluctuate? I suppose there is no real relationship between precious metal supply and economic wealth, so abandoning the link in favour of made up numbers might seem logical, but it at least did force some restraint on the banking system... which they could probably do with now, especialy in the USA!

Did I mention this is a world collection I'm talking about? William IV... now, if you include the coins from Hannover and Brunswick-Luneburg that also have portraits and arms of our Georges (and William!) then it gets more interesting for me. Couldn't possibly ignore any denominations, except those not used for general circulation. For example, I shouldn't collect (post William IV) Maundy, trade coins or commemorative only coins... although I do have some (drat!) As for metals, the changing metals tell half the story. In WW1 everyone used iron but in WW2 they went to zinc. Others used aluminium or brass. The gradual debasement through the 20th century reflects the economic transition from an instrinsic to an artificial currency. Isn't that fascinating?

Ummm, back to the topic I guess.... sorry if I'm breaking the mood. Basically, I like to collect everything because the changes in design and metal etc reflect the story of a country or region or regime. I would like my collection to form a kind of illustrated history. But, the problem is it all gets too big, so I am half thinking about converting my collection into a strict type collection. That is, one of each distinct design in the best condition I can find. Has anyone else here tried this? How do I resist the temptation to own a scarce date? Maybe the type approach will free me from that "obligation" For some parts of my collection it would involve serious thinning down, which I'm not sure I could stand! The other problem is I can't resist a bargain... but these days "I haven't got that date" just doesn't seem to justify a purchase. At the moment I'm putting it off, telling myself I need to sell all my duplicates first!!

I often thought it would be a nice carpentry project to try and make something like a coin cabinet, but I'm always terrified of resins in the wood and chemicals in adhesives affecting the coins. I've had CDs where adhesive in the packaging has somehow migrated onto the disks themselves... no idea how or why! Probably less of a problem with gold coins Does anyone have any thoughts on sealing coins up (in capsules, say) versus letting them "breathe" in a tray, presumably in a suitable atmosphere (does that just mean not humid?)

Rritanniar!

... and the 1983 2p wouldn't normally circulate. Maybe they'll make some pound coins with the wrong reverse when the design changes? When you think about it, with all the new designs and special issues these days, I'm surprised mistakes don't happen more often. The inspectors at the mint must be very thorough! And even if they do make a mistake or change a design mid-year it might not be discovered for ages. For example, my 2004 coin year book lists an enhanced effigy variety for a 1992 20p... never seen that before and wouldn't know what to look for!

Geoff, Thank you so much for posting about this. I went to Colin Cooke's website and found the information about the 1952 halfcrown... a fascinating story! I wonder if we'll ever see an opportunity to find a similar rarity in our change one day?

I think Chris' first post is most likely.... eagle and rays says South America to me. Don't forget that around that time an eagle could mean France, Germany, Austria, Russia or any number of European interests. When I read 1/8 I thought of the anchor coins, but the poster would have mentioned an anchor. Also, we don't know if it's copper or silver... I guess copper if it was in with pennies (cents), but that part of the world is nearly all silver coins... Sweden had 1/8 Riksdaler, but it doesn't fit the description. Any more clues? What metal is it and what is the eagle doing... anything in its mouth or talons?

Thinking about it... one thing that puts me off the trays is that you are tied to arranging your coins according to the compartments in the trays, so all the small coins together and all the big coins together. If you could get rows of compartments that you could arrange in a tray as you like then that would be much more appealing to me. Chris mentioned the Nova trays and I've noticed they do one (tray 6360) which is one big compartment. If you laid out coins on there would they stay put or would they slide about? Would something be needed on top to keep the coins below in place? I have experimented with CD boxes, reasonably thick cardboard and black velvet and made some mini trays which work well for some of my coins. It's a nice tight fit to hold the coins in but still completly free form for laying out.

Gorgeous aren't they! i do exactly the same can't beat a good bit of mahogany... OK.... so both your collections live in luxury 5 star hotels while mine are packed into a run down high rise block of flats Although the cabinets are lovely, I don't think my coins quite justify that level of accomodation, plus I expect I would need several! If you got to the stage where your cabinet was full, would you buy another cabinet or sell some coins?

Don't know if anyone is still interested in this old thread, but I think the coin is a Russian 5 Kopeck.

OK, not an advert but more of a tip... If you can't find jeweller's eyeglasses (often called jeweller's loupes) anywhere and you want to try before you buy, try specialist camera shops. Photographers use them to examine prints and negatives. My local shop in Southampton has quite a range!

... not really, but there is a page on the Royal Mint web site that reinforces what you say. They say it includes coins "generally found to be in circulation". Here's the url http://www.royalmint.com/talk/introduction_dem.asp

So, is it just coincidence that Elizabeth is the same in Latin and English? I looked in my coin book at Elizabeth I coins and the spelling was the same as we use now. I think when someone accedes to the throne they (or the courtiers) can choose another name for their name as monarch. They all have several names each to start with. For example, George VI was prince Albert and Edward VII was prince Albert too. Also, I just discovered Queen Victoria's first name was Alexandrina! Anyway, Charles is Charles Philip Arthur George... so take your pick!

You sound like me when I realised I had disposable income and then discovered ebay for coins. Now I just specialise in world coins from ancient to the present day Seriously... we have long lives ahead of us and if you rush to buy coins now you will regret some of those purchases. Look out for good coins at good prices. If you're not completely happy with a coin then don't buy it... another one will come along, even the scarce ones turn up all the time. You deserve the best examples you can afford and when you find them they are worth waiting for. That's what I think anyway... Mark

... and you could mention that in those days you could build a collection from change in your pocket spanning 100 years and five monarchs, but now all you can get are 30 year old coppers. Or, you could look forward to the Euro and say how we would be able to pick out coins from other countries in our change. After all, we haven't changed our currency for 30 years... Mark