oldcopper

Thanks. And Spinks lighting makes the marks more obvious.

Comparing the 1837 in both catalogues shows the very unflattering colour quality of the Adam's catalogue. Only fully BU coins or near so showed any orange, and the 1837 didn't look lustrous at all.

I was the underbidder, but thought hundreds would have spotted it, so didn't hold out too much hope. Perhaps I should have gone a bid or two higher.

I presume they'll still be on the CNG website archive.

Yes, sorry, I was just talking about the copper as it would have more relevance to them buying the more expensive Workman pieces.

Though I can't be sure of course, I don't think Atlas bought them as they have got a good eye for copper that they can buy at reasonable prices, mark up strongly and still sell, so eg coronets at what would be $30k plus would feel like a stretch. Also I have never seen them risk buying unprecedentedly really expensive copper ie none of the copper from Cope 1 has turned up on their website (which I check reasonably regularly) with the exception of that relatively cheap 1849. Recent earlier sky-high copper (eg 2023, 1699 halfpenny plus farthing ex Heritage) hasn't appeared with them either to my knowledge. They got the 1849 for a good price and if I'd hung around for it, I might have bid up to that figure if not more. It was less bright in the hand than the 1837 though.

American perhaps? and the same person probably got a lot at the first Geoffrey Cope auction. You get the feeling whoever it is has an unlimited budget and likes their big ticket copper and bronze proofs and patterns. A bad combination for the rest of us!

I thought that for part 1, until the prices for the ones I wanted went ballistic.

like the coin dealer David Seaman used to be goalkeeper for England?

A LOT better!

Incredible! - can't wait to see the catalogue, though presumably online only as have been the last few SR auctions. Never seen a dreadnought for sale before . I don't think the 1882 no H is the finest, and giving it a teaser estimate of 2-3K means SR don't either. I'm sure Gerald Jackson had a lustrous one back in Spink USA 2014 which went for $18K from memory, perhaps Noble's mint state specimen as mentioned by Peck in his 1967 BNS Addendum.

Could be a copper fake - worth checking its weight.

I liked Neil's statement in the intro to the fixed price list: (from memory it was) "the undoubted star of the copper section is the 1827 penny". The "copper section" consisted of two coins - the 1827 penny and a £150 NEF cartwheel penny. So I can't argue with that assertion!

Interesting! It's a make of jeep apparently - I didn't know that!

Yes, if that's the copper one.

It's standard copper from the look of it. I didn't manage to look at it when I was there, but I wonder why CNG called it "blazing", usually an adjective for full proof red lustre, whereas NGC graded it as a BN! But I'd have thought it could reach an RB from the photo, though colour can be deceptive in photographs of course.

Interesting times. This from Wikipedia (Raleigh was originally imprisoned in the Tower since 1603 for his part in a plot against James): In 1617, Raleigh was pardoned by the King and granted permission to conduct a second expedition to Venezuela in search of El Dorado. During the expedition, a detachment of Raleigh's men under the command of his long-time friend Lawrence Kemys attacked the Spanish outpost of Santo Tomé de Guayana on the Orinoco river, in violation of peace treaties with Spain and against Raleigh's orders. A condition of Raleigh's pardon was avoidance of any hostility against Spanish colonies or shipping. In the initial attack on the settlement, Raleigh's son, Walter, was fatally shot. Kemys informed Raleigh of his son's death and begged for forgiveness, but did not receive it, and at once committed suicide. On Raleigh's return to England, an outraged Count Gondomar, the Spanish ambassador, demanded that Raleigh's death sentence be reinstated by King James, who had little choice but to do so. Raleigh was brought to London from Plymouth by Sir Lewis Stukley, where he passed up numerous opportunities to make an effective escape.[55][56] It goes on to say that after his execution, his embalmed head was presented to his wife - perhaps so she could bury it?

Wasn't his love interest about 5 years old at the time?! In reality that is, but like Gibson's film The Patriot, Braveheart is disgustingly anti-English or anti-British, they're all caricatures. I saw a critique of the Patriot, which I've never watched nor intend to, referring to a scene in which American families were herded into a church by the British soldiers and it was set on fire. The Nazis might have done things like that, but the British never did anything remotely like that of course. Thanks Mel!

Historic people do get stereotyped of course. Charles I of course believed he was divine so why should he take orders from non-divine commoners? Not a likeable trait today of course (!) but thought processes several centuries ago would have been different. There was a drama about George IV and Wellington on BBC a few years ago. Wellington was portrayed as the wise elder statesman doling out paternalistic advice to the young buck George when he was Prince Regent. Only one problem with that - in real life George IV was 7 years older than the Duke of Wellington!

Oh well it was a nice thought!

Yes

Great to watch, shame about the prices! Even the auctioneer sounded surprised -"I sink zee auctioneer is zee least important person here!" he said as the internet pings were almost merging into a continuous sound. Though I didn't understand them rerunning two of the James II halfcrowns as the original winner had decided he hadn't meant to bid for them or something like that...had I caught that right? Maybe the auction house had got some bids mixed up. I can only speak of the copper but I wonder what will be in part 2, going on what was in part 1. I spotted at least five pieces ex Nicholson, three I assume bought direct from CC's auction in 2004 plus the Anne and George I silver halfpennies bought a year later at St James. So I'm thinking for October at least one of Nicholson's two outstanding W&M tin halfpennies plus the 1701 no stops obverse. But who knows? Looks like someone was going as high as needed to get many of those early coppers based on how quickly they were pinging counterbids. Makes the lustrous 1849 penny seem reasonable at 3K. I'd given up by then though, zero success! I wasn't too disappointed though considering what i would have to have paid to win them, and they might have gone far higher of course.

Good luck. I know there are two reverse dies for the GVLIEEMVS 1700 variety. Anyway, I wish I'd noticed the SNC 2002 GVLIEMVS plus stop example at the time which was listed as the standard variety.

Here's the Nicholson example (from CC's website) but no stop after NIA. I think Croydon Coin Auctions (or possibly London Coins) sold one a few years ago with the stop after BRITANNIA, which was probably the misdescribed-as-normal photographed example in SNC Oct 2002. Like the GVLILMVS reverse, where the stop was not recorded by Peck as it was not visible on the one example he knew, which was the double struck Johnstone example. However, an example turned up subsequently (LC) showing a clear reverse stop on the same die..

There's the stated mintage of the 1831 proof sets, which is given as 120 sets. How reliable or where this number is from I don't know, but that's always the figure used in catalogues, annuals etc. I should also add it's often accompanied by the prefix circa, which makes it look more like a later estimate, so it might not even be official. Actual records of early 19th century proof set numbers haven't survived or were never made as far as I know. It's thought an unspecified number of extra proofs were also minted, often late strikings in some cases especially for the 1839 set, how many per denomination not known, and if so, for the William proofs the mintage would have been higher than 120. There are also the non-proof-set varieties like the 1831 milled edge sixpence mentioned and the upright bronzed proofs for example, and each 1831 denomination has extra proof varieties.