Rob

Given the scarcity of it, I would think a few dies are involved. Most of the metal composition/flan preparation/striking force issues were solved in the multitude of patterns struck in the previous few years, with some types only known with laminating flans for example. Never underestimate the Mint's ability to produce a number of rogue batches from time to time. In the mid-1840s, they were only getting a couple thousand from a die pair. A quick perusal of Linton's article in the BNJ regarding the 1848 halfcrowns is quite enlightening regarding flan quality for much of the decade. ‘The half-crowns of 1848’, 29 (1958-59), p.191-93. According to records, 91872 halfcrowns were struck in 1848. The mint had 13 obverse dies available at the end of 1847, all dated 1846. A further 16 (presumably unfinished) 184(-) were made in 1847, but not required, leaving them available for use in 1848. A potential 29 dies for the 91K struck, but only a handful of the unfinished dies (2 or 3) were completed and dated 1848, most being 1848/6. (One can assumed to be dated 1847, just to test the die batch). The previous year, a total of 22 obv. dies were used to destruction for an output of 367,488 coins. Hardly a long life by normal expectations. Again, there was an 1848/7 in the Adams collection which was possibly 8/7/6, but not conclusively so in hand. Similarly for the 1849/7/(6?). All very interesting, but requiring much speculation until clearer examples come to light. The 1849 in particular, was a real dog of a coin, but even so, unambiguous for the 9/7. Just because it has been given R16, it is only a reflection of the percentage of coins examined during research relative to other 1861s. What if a ton or two of output was lost at sea following despatch? We don't know.

FWIW, this is my 5+G. The obverse die is close to destruction and the coin somewhat spotty, but all features are clear.

I am not aware of any other obverses which show a similar flaw, but that is only what I have seen. The lighthouse is reverse G because the shape is more of a gaussian distribution with a pointy hat. E has straighter sides. I know 6+G exists with the first 1/1 as I used to have one, but the recut is lower, not higher. I do wonder if your coin has been slightly double struck on part of the flan, as the obverse rim shows a slight discontinuity(?) at 11 o'clock with another between 1 and 2. That could account for the crazy date alignment which is what sticks out most to me,, unless I am seeing things.

The lack of credibility (perceived or imagined), stemmed from the conflict of interest of the owners given the connection to LCA, through which many coins were sold at auction. Grading of their slabs in my opinion was rarely an issue, which given their association with GB coinage is as it should be. They were more familiar with British coins than the US TPGs will ever be. As ever, caveat emptor.

Happy Days. I think I will have a few pints in the local tonight. Given their pricing, it is clear evidence of the cost of nationwide advertsiing in papers and TV is not insubstantial - or someone has run off with the bank account funds. I would go further than no great loss, as it removes a source of overpriced material sold to people with a limited grasp on coin prices, and as an afterthought, maybe the recent IHT adjustments for pensions etc has led to the wealthy gullible reviewing their methods for passing on things to the descendants.

Ignorance is bliss. There is a raised line on the hull, it just happens to be the ship's handrail running from bow to stern. Mine is very prominent in hand. The atttribution presumaby coming from a phrase search of their limited literature. At the end of the day, it is a business boxing above its weight in terms of knowledge when claiming to be all things to all people and (like Trump) never wrong - hence many fictitious attributions and for knowledgable people, just used as a pointer toward a potentially decent coin. However, an unquestionable marketing success. I don't know if they still offer a cleaning service, but it seems to have laid low after I questioned why they were so intent on selling 'unsightly' wax removal given it was historical evidence of past illustration in early catalogues.

Nice if you can get them, but Hobson's Choice requires my collection to have more than a few dogs hidden away. Still, mustn't grumble as I've done ok over the years.

I concur. The approach to the newsagent is a lucrative source of income.

I can only offer Peck's attribution to this idea as it was his designation. Applicable to non-currrency coin only and either contemporary with the date seen, or struck at some later date as presents to friends and visitors. I think it unlikely that any accuracy will be achieved without documentary evidence of specific visitors to Soho along with the dates, unlike the restrikes which being continually modified show clear underlying detail so that a progression can be established along with a probable date using other evidence.

ditto

Worn collars? Reduced striking force to preserve the dies? Different degrees of circulation? Wartime conditions will often lead to slightly flexible interpretation of the rules. Even within nominally identical parts, engineering tolerances can lead to something that looks wrong, even if functionally and usefully ok. Think along the lines of WW1 pennies that were often weakly struck to save replacing the dies so often.

id'ing and recognising a cleaned coin shouldn't be that difficult. Polished to hell and back again isn't difficult to recognise, but anything not dipped to a brilliant white finish seems to get lumped in with cleaned coins. I have seen a couple of early milled crowns this month to die for at cleaned prices. Sadly I wasn't the first to spot them. Mint state both. They don't use all the tools at their disposal for id'ing copper either, so again, bargains to be had alongside some odd designations. eg. My 1860 Weyl uniface penny F881 ranked 308th in the pecking order of NGC's 1860 halfpennies P- unlisted. See the thread in the TPG discussions and go figure. You are not alone in your distrust.

For what it is worth, I think it is a P1242 also. 3 incuse dots limits your obverse options as per Peck's KH17 (P1236) & KH21 (P1242). The reverse isn't that of KH16 due to lack of flaw under Britannia's armpit and the 1 is well clear of the sea, which eliminates P1236. Thus leaving KH21, (which uses the reverse of KH20) as the correct designation. However, it might be worth qualifying that attribution if the pictures were better. I say this because the images are too low resolution to compare directly with my own cleanly struck example. 1. Do the 3 incuse dots on the truncation align correctly? 2. Is the area underneath the armpit devoid of any flaws? 3. Is there any trace of gunports, however weak they may be? 4. Is the flag on the poop the same size? Mine has gunports that are barely detectable, but are clearly present. The image gives an impression of a plain hull - which it isn't. If all those points align on the two coins, then we can safely say it is a P1242 from the same die pair. Given this is a late SOHO strike, it is possible that there might be additional rust spots appearing, but likely only minor ones, as Taylor didn't acquire the dies. Alternatively and with wishful thinking, a coin with massive die breaks would help settle this once and for all.

If he manufactures another world war, then he would try to retain the position, just like Roosevelt was retained in power as an emergency measure. However, someone, somewhere will take him out before that happens. 99.9% certain of that because the queue of people chomping at the bit would go round the White House many times over. Sanity will be restored once the Senate and Congress regain their moral compass, and the Supreme Court grow a pair of balls rather than kow-towing to his ego.

Whatever the kit used, it should be possible to ascertain the weight loss. Given the tolerances in flan weight, the important number is the approximate weight loss of the removed material

Contemplating what? The thought of how your guts are going to feel like drinking all that ingredient filled fizzy pop. Or more hopefully, thinking you could move upmarket in your taste. Get some proper beer in!!!

I think he has already explored that option, but if he tried to enact it, all hell would let loose and would result in massive internal upheaval of the violent kind. As ever, he says something and waits for the reaction before pursuing whatever he is trying to implement. The military swears an oath of allegiance to the Constitution, not Trump, so you have an instant division of the armed forces, and as much as he thinks he is popular, that would be a step too far in the view of most Americans, whatever side they are on. Only him and his buddies would benefit in the short term at the expense of the rest of the population who will of necessity have a hard time. But in time he will turn on his friends too, as all dictators end up doing this eventually when someone disagrees with them. IMO It won't fly - thankfully.

In the overall scheme of things, the legend doesn't actually weigh that much. I doubt it would be more than 0.2-0.3g, if that. Whilst the relief appears quite prominent, it doesn't actually cover that much surface area given both limb thickness and height is less than a mm for just about any letter, and there is plenty of space in the holes. I guess if you have access to a lathe and are practical, you could try removing them off a good penny and measure the actual weight loss.

Call it the Trump effect. Very few people in this world can move markets like a US president, and very few US presidents have had ambitions to tank their own economy like Trump, due to his Stable coin collateral, which will inflate the debt away. The pound isn't stronger because of the left wing government in this country, rather because the tea leaf readings of the wannabe dictator across the pond aren't good for the US economy. Trump is of course happy with events because his personal wealth is keeping up with the collapse in the dollar, and he is always right. Methinks American Revolution 2.0 might be closer than you might imagine.

There are very few rules in play, only generalities due to the number of variables involved. Most will conform to type, but there is always the exception, hence the need to keep an open mind regarding potential alternative explanations. If an unc coin is determined by wear to the struck relief detail, then it could stay 'unc' for a while until sufficient protection has worn away to affect the die struck detail. That is why practically as struck could be considered aposite, but then, there will never be a consensus, only your own viewpoint.

Depends on the age of the collar, and how intact the links are. Eventually it will burst with a resulting mistrike, likely quite spectacular. A small ring of raised excess metal is a good diagnostic tool for working out how much circulation the coin has seen. If still visible and obviously worn down, it ain't unc, despite offering some added protection to the die relief.

Looks more like a faulty flan than die. Lamination along fault layers due to trapped impurities in the mix are reasonably common, even today. Lumps on the surface are predominantly due to poor storage and resulting rust on the die which then flakes off when used, leaving an area of raised spots. This area can be any size up to an including the whole die face. If you search for rust spots or lamination on the forum, you can see many examples of these features.

Currency. Too many things wrong for a proof. Using Peck's arguments for proof examples, the 1 should be clear of the sea, no flaws and should have a grained edge (which both currency and proofs have). The rims aren't good enough either. Peck also states the currency as having a grained edge in a deep groove, whilst saying the proof is merely grained. Normally this means light oblique graining in the centre of the edge, not in a groove. However, if it wasn't in a groove, there would be no reason to mention the other criteria as this alone would suffice. Muddy waters here. Prooflike examples are frequently encountered, but that is normally an early strike using fresh dies. Not surprising if you think about it, as a resetting of the press will probably require the force to be adjusted to reflect the new positions of the dies, which despite being nearly there, are inevitably going to be a few microns out as a minimum. Think physical length and diameter together with the depth of the relief.

Whilst the interest in collecting from change may fade away, the interest in rarities, especially nice ones, is likely to be subsumed into the general collector desire for quality rarities seen across all spheres. Otherwise, how do you explain the prices paid for hammered coins, none of which circulated in living memory. Their desirability stems from the history and all coins are part of that same history. Not all denominations have a large following, but one day their turn will come when relative rarities are fully appreciated. Take halfpennies. Much rarer than pennies in top grade because alongside farthings, they were the mainstay of the working class cash economy. That means a high grade example is always a good long term bet given they weren't normally set aside and collected per se. It is a common thread throughout history. Look at Roman sestertii as an example. These were the circulating base coinage of the Roman era, and again, not something the rich and famous would set aside. However, the Bolsena Hoard found in the late 19th century in northern Italy provides ample evidence that even 1700 years ago someone thought them collectable. As the hoard contained a large number of top grade sestertii spanning a few centuries, it beggars belief that they were collected from circulation. The hoard only makes sense as a collection. i.e. we are just the latest in a long history of people who collect from interest, rather than as an investment. As I wrote in my testimony to Cope part 2. We 'met' on ebay. He, as my regular nemesis, eventually asking if I was a copper collector. Silly and obvious really. When we had both bid over twice book on a lustrous 1718 halfpenny that came back in the sale as a 65RB, it was clear that we both appreciated the relative quality of the coin, and how infrequently they turn up. High grade modern pennies will also fall into that same collectable category once enough have been melted and are no longer readily available, and this might happen sooner than you think. In the past 20 years, I estimate that I have consigned somewhere near a ton of bronze to be melted of all denominations. Why? Because nobody wanted them, so you melt to free up cash. The odd rare piece will have gone through undetected, but the vast majority will have been worth scrap value. I am not alone in having done this. This will increase the relative abundance of the rarities over time. Every dog has its day, and as far as I can see, always will do so on a recurring basis.