argentumandcoins

The big problem is that you would have to invest massively to make it worthwhile and that is a huge gamble. It is down about £130/ounce since it's December high of £1100. A £5k investment would therefore net approx £500 IF it hit the heights of late 2011. If it falls away you have maybe just blown £500. My own personal advice would be to take your £5k and try to buy a decent quality 5 Guinea if you want some gold. At least you would have something nice to admire and to a certain degree you would be protected against gambling on the futures market. As always, "your money, your call"

Very, in high grade, along with the 05 Halfcrown which is also faked in abundance. Whats more worrying is that John mentioned that the shilling was in someones collection for 10 years and he thought for all those 10 years it was genuine. We all assumed the Chinese has been at this for 4 or 5 years, but who knows where this one has come from. Did the seller tell you John? He couldn't recall due to the length of time he had held it.

What? I thought that was massive! I've only just realised it's being hung from the gallows! Female engraver then! If this sells for £300 I swear I will dig out my old engraver! Buy it for £109, wait a month (probably shipping time etc) and try to sell it on the same site for £300? If anybody pays it it's them as should be strung up by the nads!

Alan, you're right, I'm wrong. Laurie Bamford and Michael Gouby were/are wrong as well. The 1876 was struck at London and this is obviously the best example extant. Sorry for wasting your time. Daz if you want to sell it I'll put it through an auction with a £20-£30k estimate for you.

No, it has nothing to do with the Premier League run-in! I just logged onto my ebay account and saw the nice message from HMRC about online selling. It appears that they are going to start to get their teeth into anybody who buys and sells online, and I mean anybody! When you read the terms of online trading it will certainly affect 99.9% of the sellers on ebay (yes even you fellow members who use it to move on swaps). It appears that you have until 14/06/12 to declare your interest and benefit from a preferential agreement, after that your ass is grass. Thankfully it won't affect me at all as I have to declare every cent already. I predict a few high profile court cases fairly quickly this year and after that we should start to see a decline in the peddlars of shite that flood the pages with "£9.99 1967 pennieys from mye granmars draw wot she have had sinse they was maded" Thank you HMRC, thank you.

All men were created equal, it's just that some are more equal than others.

Peter if you want them I will gladly send you all I have at absolutely no charge (yes, I know I can spend the 2p and 1p). Who said I was a heartless git? Oh, yes, it was my ex (well all of them actually)

I can make out the entire right hand upright of the H, and the top half of the left. (I zoomed my screen.) Likewise. I zoomed in on the iMac and can see this fairly clearly. I guess the people who can't see it don't have Macs I can see it without anything. A definite area of discolouration underneath the date between the 7 and the 6. Tell tale mark of a rubbed away H daz if the coin is real get it xrayed it won't cost a lot, all they do on this site is take the piss.if you won't you can contact me it's alan - plantdav@gmail.com Alan, Who exactly is taking the Piss? I now make my living selling coins and working as an independant consultant for auction houses. I don't handle 200-300 coins a year, I average that number in a day. The coin has clearly been altered and then made to look distressed, that is obvious from the vertical smear mark showing down Britannias arm. If you want proof it is an attempt to decieve send it to me and I will pay the £50 submission cost to Robert Matthews to have him write a full report on why it is an altered coin. Sorry if you feel slighted in any way, that was not my intent. John.

I didn't think there was VAT payable on collectables, please tell me this is just Germany we're talking about? The buyer does not pay the VAT Stuart. UK dealers all work on the VAT global accounting and Margin Schemes. It means we cannot charge VAT to the customer or we end up paying the full rate on every penny we take in rather than on the profits we make. That's assuming that your dealer is VAT registered of course. No, I meant as a seller. In 1996 I had a little wobble with the tax man, and have played him at his own game ever since! If I as much sell a lightbulb to a neighbour, I factor in the wear on my shoes walking to his house, how much space it took up in my own home, to the toilet roll I wrapped it up in to delivery it safely to his door...profit .75p, expenses .76p! I am below the VAT threshold, but this doesn't always mean you're not affected by it. I had a scare for a moment, thinking there was a 7% figure I'd overlooked, that customs would come knocking for one day! Hopefully I'm right in thinking this is not applicable to me, as I've never used an accountant, not ever, but probably should one day if I wish to remain an ageing stress-free hippy! If you look at the HMRC website VAT is due if you earn over the threshold (Either £75k or £72k, I forget what the threshold is). After that you should be registered for VAT and pay at 20% on everything you take. Antique/stamp/coin dealers etc can opt to use a different scheme or 2 different schemes concurrently. It's a pain in the posterior keeping on top of it but it saves any grief at a later date. The new selling rules are going to hit anybody that buys to sell or is a regular seller. I only skim read the HMRC blurb on it because it does not apply to me as I am already registered with them. The way I understand it is that people like Declan will be liable for 20% at the base rate on anything they earn over the personal allowance.

I didn't think there was VAT payable on collectables, please tell me this is just Germany we're talking about? The buyer does not pay the VAT Stuart. UK dealers all work on the VAT global accounting and Margin Schemes. It means we cannot charge VAT to the customer or we end up paying the full rate on every penny we take in rather than on the profits we make. That's assuming that your dealer is VAT registered of course.

Declan with your lass been from Aspatria I would have thought that you would know full well "COUGH NOWT" What they can't prove they can't charge you with! Now you'll have to go on the run in your bus!

I can make out the entire right hand upright of the H, and the top half of the left. (I zoomed my screen.) Likewise. I zoomed in on the iMac and can see this fairly clearly. I looked at this photo with photo zoom pro,could see no H,any chance of a better photo please Daz. A handy pointer that the coin has been altered is the fact that it has been artificially "dirtied" for want of a better word. Some people like to clean coins, nobody likes to make them look worse than they are unless they are trying to disguise something. I guess in the end you'll see what you want to see though.

Polished to buggery and a private listing (AND WE ALL KNOW HOW THEY GET SHILLED UPON) to boot! Maximus Scrotumus Cranius will undoubtedly outbid I LIKUS THE SHINUS in the final seconds.

Even the sharpest get stung there occasionally. The most successful strikes on e bay fall into two camps, in my experience:- a) Nice coins with a high initial bid price, which nevertheless is still nowhere near their true value. Would be bidders are strangely put off by the high start price, and often by-pass it completely, leaving someone else to make the only punt at the original price, thus bagging a real bargain. b ) Really high end coins which would be better off in a proper auction. They will sell, for sure, but usually end up at between 55% to 75% of what they could potentially realise elsewhere. It's a real mistake for high quality expensive coins to be put on e bay. Gambling strikes which may or may not pay off, are on those with poor photography, where the coin cannot properly be seen. This often puts buyers off, leaving the speculator room for a potential killing, or to get their fingers burned. There has been (and will probably continue to be) another more sinister ebay tactic; the seller of the major/undiscovered rarity, thta is actually a forgery. 2 examples leap to mind; the 1860 unrecorded die pairing penny about 3 years ago and the "plain edge proof" 1819 Crown that is now on offer at a major auction house with the tag that the edge has been deliberately smoothed. The first coin was an excellent effort and I think I pushed it to about £1500 (I am sure there will be another member or two on here who also had a stab at it). I cannot comment on the second as I did not see it sold on ebay. This type of scam is very worrying, particularly when the forger is very skilled. Another area of selling is the "unable to price it" item. I sell lots of things on there that seem to fetch incredible prices (mainly exonumia) and foreign coins where I need access to a worldwide customer base which you just don't get with your website (or seem not to get). For all the pitfalls of ebay the plain truth is that I need it to survive (where else do you get rid of 1971 first decimal sets?) Just as a matter of interest, John, how did that emerge as being a forgery ? Also, was it tooled, or an out and out fake ? I don't know how it was found out initially but Michael Gouby records it on page 100 of the Speciallist edition. He sounds like he has handled it himself and goes on to say that it went to the RM who concurred that the 0 had been altered from a 1.

Yep..I want a Porsche Cayman and pair of beautiful discreet early 20's ladies....and a pint cos it is afternoon That's two pairs, surely? (Oops, sorry Debs) Doh! I thought he was talking about a nice pair of Art Nouveau bronze and ivory figures

azda, i sincerely hope that you and peckris both understand that my posts were meant in good faith and also meant to differentiate between the bad that occurs on ebay, those you have highlighted as shill bidders, those who clearly sell the utmost of polished crap, designed to mislead, and the genuine dealer, whom may have had a difference in grading to personal levels. we may all disagree on grade of a particular coin at times with bona fida dealers, that happens, we have different ideas and ideals, different knowledge of a specific coin/dies....etc etc, but it sure must be difficult to be all embracing. azda....how many times have you come on here to ask for die pairings/references for a particular penny.....loads azda....how many times have you asked for a grading on a particular coin...................................loads does that make you or any other here better than CC or Rendell........maybe yes, maybe no. but yes it does make YOU and Peckris and CC and Rendell and all the others here far and away better than the those shill bidders, crap sellers on ebay...........and that was the whole point of my original post....... im gonna leave this forum now................theres clearly no place for a prick like me here. ski I wouldn't worry, ski. There will always be disagreements with people even in the most (normally) harmonious of settings. Doesn't mean they're by default right, and you're wrong. Sometimes they will be and sometimes you will be. Sometimes you will both be half right and half wrong. Whichever, it's not worth putting yourself down and leaving for, as it will all be forgotten in a few days anyway. If you have something to say, say it, and if it happens to upset someone, then tough do dahs. It's life, it's the way it is. You should see many of the comments made and insults exchanged on some forums. Makes the worst of what you see on here look like a Sunday School outing. That's the trouble with fora, a timid gutless coward all of a sudden grows a pair the size of watermelons as he sits at his computer 2000 miles away from the poor recipient of the hurtful dirge. As Mike said Ski, divn't worry aboot it marra. I've got skin thicker than a Rhinos arse so you or anybody else might get me revved up for a minute or two but after that I start to worry about more important things like "can Newcastle stuff the Toffees the day?" Not on this occasion, John. I was hoping they would, too. Pleased for Man City ~ was really Boys Own Annual stuff getting those 2 goals in injury time. On a sour note, I note that psycho Barton got sent off again, and hopefully will face a lengthy ban. Sorry to go off topic, folks The Mighty Mags came "unstuck" against the Toffees Didn't matter in the end with Arsenal and Arry's boys winning. Still a great season for us though. I think City deserved it this year and congrats to them. Barton.... "taxi to Broadmoor" That lad has totally lost the plot. I think Hughes will offload him (or try to at least) as he could have cost them about £95million if Bolton had got another goal.

I was one of Ashleys biggest critics but I have to eat a large slice of humble pie, a Cabaye, Santon, Ba and Cisse for less than half the price of an Andy Carroll looks like a good bit of business to me. Fingers crossed that he invests in the Summer again and who knows where we'll end up next year

I think what they're saying here is 'ow, Burt, it's not fair (stamps foot on floor), why can't we just say NEF? EBay gets away with it, do you really think anyone would notice (winks eye at colleague)?' Godwin gets on the PC replying 'don't worry, I have a plan, and I shall say zis only wunse, let's use our new "eBay Price Guide" to set the estimate (winks at his colleague, and sucks back a little bit of spittle and pea juice from the corner of his mouth)!' So, the first official acknowledgement that eBay are the world market leaders is numismatics, who would've thought it? 'The eBay Auction Price Guide for Numismatists'! The trouble is Ebay worldwide shift more coins (and crap) than all the rest of the dealers on the planet.The Yanks have actual price lists and try to reach exact grading....and we still operate "cash is king" at fairs,auctions and dealers.I did witness an American trying to insist a dealer at the Midland accepts his offer based on his price list....he didn't You always get the odd one trying it on. It's normally "Spink price is only blah blah". I often feel like giving them a Brick Top line from Snatch in reply "When I throw a dog a bone I don't wanna know if it likes the taste or not"

azda, i sincerely hope that you and peckris both understand that my posts were meant in good faith and also meant to differentiate between the bad that occurs on ebay, those you have highlighted as shill bidders, those who clearly sell the utmost of polished crap, designed to mislead, and the genuine dealer, whom may have had a difference in grading to personal levels. we may all disagree on grade of a particular coin at times with bona fida dealers, that happens, we have different ideas and ideals, different knowledge of a specific coin/dies....etc etc, but it sure must be difficult to be all embracing. azda....how many times have you come on here to ask for die pairings/references for a particular penny.....loads azda....how many times have you asked for a grading on a particular coin...................................loads does that make you or any other here better than CC or Rendell........maybe yes, maybe no. but yes it does make YOU and Peckris and CC and Rendell and all the others here far and away better than the those shill bidders, crap sellers on ebay...........and that was the whole point of my original post....... im gonna leave this forum now................theres clearly no place for a prick like me here. ski I wouldn't worry, ski. There will always be disagreements with people even in the most (normally) harmonious of settings. Doesn't mean they're by default right, and you're wrong. Sometimes they will be and sometimes you will be. Sometimes you will both be half right and half wrong. Whichever, it's not worth putting yourself down and leaving for, as it will all be forgotten in a few days anyway. If you have something to say, say it, and if it happens to upset someone, then tough do dahs. It's life, it's the way it is. You should see many of the comments made and insults exchanged on some forums. Makes the worst of what you see on here look like a Sunday School outing. That's the trouble with fora, a timid gutless coward all of a sudden grows a pair the size of watermelons as he sits at his computer 2000 miles away from the poor recipient of the hurtful dirge. As Mike said Ski, divn't worry aboot it marra. I've got skin thicker than a Rhinos arse so you or anybody else might get me revved up for a minute or two but after that I start to worry about more important things like "can Newcastle stuff the Toffees the day?"

On 400x mag you can see the H ghosting, and that's from a digital picture. In hand it would be blatantly obvious what it was.

The plastic the slab was made out of, the colour of the info card, the font style/size/colour etc etc

No need to apologise in my opinion Ski. Thou spaketh as thou fundeth and that is all I expect from anybody in life. I came back at Nick a wee bit strong myself, but we're all big boys on here (apart from Debbie of course) and should neither take offence or harbour grudges. The beauty about coins is the fact that we can agree or disagree about them amongst ourselves but we're never short of something to discuss. The only real answer to the grading issue is to set-up a slabbing robot that graded with 100% accuracy 100% of the time as we are humans and humans make mistakes. The difference between good and bad (people in general) is that the good ones try to make ammends.

I just had a copy of "The Silver Token Coinage" by Dalton delivered today. It's one of those photocopied from the original re-print efforts. Thin card covers and 9 1/2 x 7 1/2 inches but it does the job at a fraction of the price of an original version. If anybody is interested it was from Amazon for £10.16 including postage.

7, but only because I have a good memory and this was on the BBC website about 5 weeks ago? There was another post about it and I think I got 5 first time around (Somalia and Spur Ryal being the 2 that got me)

Sorry but it was never for sale. It has gone to a forum member for a donation to the Air Ambulance and I know he is more than willing to share it around for similar donations to the same charity (whichever area the coin goes to is the one the donation is made at). I could not allow that coin onto the open market as it is more than good enough to draw suckers in and sell for 3 figures.