Peckris

I didn't know you'd found your own Turkish Delight Dave! I don't know the Turkish for "Salaam mw'allykom", but I bet she does! didnt realise peckris that you were fluent in jock.............. And it's improved greatly since King Kenny returned to the fold

ARRRRRASS-waip

DM sent Rob.

How would a Greek bankruptcy affect them, being next door neighbours etc, etc ? Did you really call that nasty man an arsewipe ? They probably have very little exposure to Greece as i) they aren't in the EC, and ii) they hate each others guts. How Turkish banks get round the Islamic ban on charging interest, I don't know, perhaps they just call it something else. And, yes he did. LOL. They're hardly the most Islamist of nations are they! I get the feeling the descendants of Ataturk would rather be entering the Eurovision Song Contest than getting their own Ayatollah.

Gold in top grade with no wear and only a couple of tiny marks will win hands down unless the lower grade piece is an acknowledged rarity whose supply is far outstripped by demand. Spink prices them reasonably similarly as a couple of hundred either way is not really here or there, but 1832 is flagged up as a date for counterfeits, so do some homework before you buy. PS. Why do you wink your wife in public, or is it a coded message? Just because Dave missed an "O" I think it must be a Scottish thing...what with battered mars bars,men wearing skirts,big ginger men,tossing the caber...funny race really. And don't forget dancing on the cutlery, losing their purse when it's their round, thrashing a sphere of rubber bands around the countryside with sticks, and having free care for their disabled and elderly .... WAIT! I'm off up there...

So let's see, what have we got to look forward to... More riots Hunger strikes in Ireland Another pointless war a Miner's strike the Battle of the Beanfield (Dale Farm?) Deregulation of the Financial Industry More riots a nuclear disaster Stock market crash the disintegration of a superpower and the Poll Tax to wrap up the decade... I think it was Mark Twain who said History doesn't repeat itself, but it always rhymes. Do we have a closet FT reader here? Erm, weren't his initials MT ?

If you look at Nick's post above (19th August) he gives reference to 2 Dutch websites which may give more information? (You will need to use Google Translate, unless you're a fluent Dutch speaker - I'm only conversant with Double Dutch myself )

So let's see, what have we got to look forward to... More riots Hunger strikes in Ireland Another pointless war a Miner's strike the Battle of the Beanfield (Dale Farm?) Deregulation of the Financial Industry More riots a nuclear disaster Stock market crash the disintegration of a superpower and the Poll Tax to wrap up the decade... I think it was Mark Twain who said History doesn't repeat itself, but it always rhymes. What I can't understand is the the powers that be not banning all these loan firms,ambulance chasing,miss selling etc and actually spin doctoring UK products. Everything is being produced in Asia from computors to pencils and shipped into the UK in vast containers.The French would be blocking the ports. Even Dr Martens and Dyson cleaners are being manufactured in the far east. There will be more riots because the masses are envying their neighbours. The financial industry is bent but this has always been the case its a natural human trait. OK lets bring back the 80's.In the early 80's I was single,no £ pressure,Ipswich Town were Englands best team .I had lads holidays I had a motorbike,I could abuse my body and still get down the pub the next lunchtime....it wasn't all bad. I'm afraid the powers that be ARE the loan firms, insurance companies, manufacturers and importers, and the masses are farmed for their envy and subsequently, their debt. The masses are of no use to the PTB unless they are consuming, preferably on borrowed money. Government is merely the legislative arm of the financial industry. Thank the Lord we still have - in theory - an independent judiciary.

The ruler was very helpful - from the rim, it was either going to be a 1797 'Cartwheel' penny or twopence copper coin. From the dimensions, I can tell you that it's the penny. In that condition (just about as bad as it could be!) it is only worth copper value. But the story behind them is of interest : No regal base metal coins were struck after 1775 and there was a dire shortage of small change. To get round this, copper tokens were struck by different manufacturers and companies, mostly for the value of a halfpenny, though there are some pennies, farthings and other values. Some of these tokens were struck by Matthew Boulton using machinery he'd developed with James Watt. These were of superior quality and he eventually won a government contract to strike the 1797 regal base metal coins. However, they had to contain their own value of copper, hence the size and why they became known as Cartwheels - the raised rim makes them very distinctive. As copper increased in price, so later strikings (halfpennies, farthings 1799; pennies, halfpennies, farthings 1806-7) reduced in size. Eventually - in the Great Recoinage of 1816 it was decreed that the coinage would be 'token', i.e. didn't have to contain its own value of metal. From 1820 (again, no base metal coins between 1807-1820), a standard size for coppers was introduced and persisted until the change-over to bronze in 1860. My avatar is the reverse of a 1797 twopence, rather dramatised - including inverting - in Photoshop!

LOL. If one of them was much scarcer than the other, THEN I'd be interested - that's my pathology! (It's why 1937 micro-varieties leave me entirely cold)

Welcome to 1980...

Just posting.

It's not doubling - but it does look like a recut A, the underlying A being a bit higher and rotated a few degrees anti-clockwise. The top of the original A seems to be protruding, and the right hand serif as you've noticed, and the bulge bottom left looks suspicious too. Recut letters are extremely common on the copper series, especially the farthings. Thanks for that.As you said, it does seem a common occurrence.Here is another 1845 I have which is similar but not quite as pronounced. Yes, that looks convincing. I'm afraid I don't have an 1845 farthing (I'm a type collector these days) so I can't go and check mine.

My thoughts : 1. There is no added numismatic value for the sixpences and threepences depending on silver content - they aren't even mentioned in catalogues and price lists. Therefore the difference between the two types won't be a factor in any grade above Fine (and below that they aren't worth collecting). 2. Therefore the only time it's important is when you want bullion value from worn coins. I would have thought that at that stage, there would be quite a difference in colour between the two? After all, the Mint got the first attempt at the new alloy badly wrong, and 50%-silver coins of 1920 and 1921 get discoloured and ugly. I realise that's not a scientific test, but it could help. But, I'm kind of wondering what profit there might be in cornering the market in worn 1920 6d's and 3d's, in order to cash in on the tiny difference in bullion value with coins that small. It seems to me that the costs incurred in trying out a definitive test would negate most of the profit? The words "worth" "trouble" "more" "it's" & "than" come to mind.

LOL - excuse my less than politeness above!

Actually, apart from a very rare example, all coins dated 1920 are 50% silver, i.e. a new alloy. It's PRE-1920 that they are sterling (92.5%) silver. The 50% silver lasted until 1946, then since 1947 all "silver" coins have been an alloy of copper and nickel. That's not quite true. There are 1920 sixpences and threepences of .925 and .500 silver. The easiest way to tell them apart is to let them fall (gently) on a hard surface and listen to the resulting sound. Then compare with a 1919 version (.925) and also with a 1921 (.500). To my ear the .925 is quite a sharp sound, whereas the .500 is a bit duller. You learn something new...

Actually, apart from a very rare example, all coins dated 1920 are 50% silver, i.e. a new alloy. It's PRE-1920 that they are sterling (92.5%) silver. The 50% silver lasted until 1946, then since 1947 all "silver" coins have been an alloy of copper and nickel.

It's someone who doesn't know what they've got ("what, on eBay?" I hear you ask...). That's a standard first reverse 1689 halfcrown. What the seller thinks is a "date stamped into the crown" is merely the pearls that form part of the design - it's all that's left of the design so it looks a bit like a series of "8"s. So if the date was 8888, then indeed it would look like that... It's around Fair+ condition if you want to bid on it, but it's not a rare variety.

It's not doubling - but it does look like a recut A, the underlying A being a bit higher and rotated a few degrees anti-clockwise. The top of the original A seems to be protruding, and the right hand serif as you've noticed, and the bulge bottom left looks suspicious too. Recut letters are extremely common on the copper series, especially the farthings.

That's just what my wife used to do in her informative years. Although I let her use the washing machine now though. As long as your wives don't beat the washing on your rocks I think its going to be OK. Spam is nice with a bit of branston or raw onion.Plus I use it sometimes as fishing bait. A cracked spambot with a modified effigy George V penny playing on a Xbox...WHATS ALL THAT ABOUT? Your grandson will know

Interesting that Michael Gouby makes no attempt to catalogue date spacing prior to 1866 1866 seems to be the worst David Probably because it is normal for 1860 - 1863 - there would be too many varieties to cope with.

You mean you tried? The obverse legend on it seems to be MARIA ANG FRA Z (et) HIB REGI (Mary, Queen of England France and Ireland), which sounds ok, but I'm no expert. The reverse legend SHOULD be VERITAS TEMPORIS FILIA but yours just has TEMPO which may be a known variation? As to whether it's a counterfeit or not, I don't know enough. It appears to be a groat.

From the convex shield it must be Reverse G. The date numerals are interesting. The second 1 appears to be closer to the 6 than you see on many others. The size of the digits may appear a bit larger due to the disappearance of the linear circle. There's a lot of variation in the date in the first few years of buns. But, you never know!

True, but it's in the nature of patterns to be 1) rare 2) exceptions to the business strike rule. They are experiments. (Though why those were double obverse, beats me).

Short for robot (unlike Rob ), i.e. an automatic - software - conveyer of spam without human intervention.