Peckris

Come on guys! Don't be shy. All I'm asking is your opinion. What do you think of these two proposed alternatives to slabbing? If such an alternative was introduced, would you consider using it? (NO commitment!)

Following on from the big discussion we've been having here : http://www.predecimal.com/forum/index.php?...=4698&st=30 I contacted CGS and said that many of us seemed interested in a good grading / attribution service, but were less than enthusiastic about slabbing. I offered them a suggestion for an alternative system. This centres around the fact that they provide a 'computer archive' photograph with slabbed coins. Based on that I offered two possible scenarios : 1. Photo-only service. Pay for a good watermarked (i.e. hard to fake) photograph which would contain enlargements of obverse and reverse, the CGS identification / grading / attribution tag, and a super-enlarged portion of a part of the coin that makes it unique (e.g. die flaw, unusual toning, spot, scratch, etc). This photograph would accompany the coin when selling and provide the same kind of enhanced value that slabbing does. 2. A slabbed photo service Instead of slabbing the coin, CGS could slab a really good photo (obverse and reverse), with the proviso that the slab used would be markedly different from those used for slabbing coins, e.g. it would be very much thinner. Likewise, this slabbed photo would accompany the coin when selling, add value, etc. Stephen Lockett emailed back and said he would put my suggestion to the CGS directors responsible. At this stage, I'd like some feedback from you guys. If, like me, you keep your coins in a cabinet and don't want to see them slabbed, would you welcome either of these alternative methods of 'adding value' to your collection? I've already indicated that I would, but obviously they will not introduce a new service for just one person. I did say that 'serious collectors' (you guys!) were a group that I felt sure that CGS would "like to embrace", but that with slabbing, this wasn't going to happen.

I believe the last issue was 1970. I think you would be lucky to pick one up for £70 although you could have mine for that when the rumoured reprint arrives Lol havent bought one my self hence me posting the origional question. I have seen 3 or 4 advertised for around £70 and there in fairly used condition. I ordered a copy when I was a schoolboy, it would have cost me £5.15s if I'd gone back to collect it. I actually got my copy from auction a few years back - £95. Funnily enough, the £5.15s.0d was more valuable to me as a schoolboy than £95 was a few years back You might be interested in the news that Predecimal are in negotiations to reprint Peck - there's a thread about it here.

There are no 1972 currency coins, except the 25p Silver Wedding crown. Which is why the proof set for that year is more expensive than any other early decimal proof set. BU sets didn't appear until 1982, so there are only proofs to fill any gaps before then. There were actually pennies minted for each year between 1860 and 1922. None were minted in 1968, 1969 (well, they were, but were dated 1967).

London Coins have one for sale : http://www.londoncoins.co.uk/index.php?pag...amp;d0=FA#coins

Yes, but this ignores the fact that many serious collectors (particularly those over a certain age) keep their coins in cabinets. Who is going to throw out their gorgeous mahogany cabinet(s) just on the transient whim of fashion? Which is what they would have to do if they got their coins slabbed. What we need - unless it already exists? - is a reputable and professional grading service that does NOT slab coins. A service that returns your coin along with a good colour photo of both sides of the coin, that also shows the grade and other relevant information (and watermarked in some way that is difficult to fake). (Or a slabbed photo!) . . Oh GOD, I hope not. How many of us here are collectors - even dealers also - of many years standing? I don't need a professional service to tell me - the grade - the eye appeal - the desirability of a coin, unless it's a series that's new to me. . . You could only peg rarities to each other of broadly very similar types. Otherwise there is no correlation. We all know that there are many varieties in Freeman that are at least as rare as the 1933 penny, yet would struggle to realise a tenth of that value. And then there's Maundy, which is extremely scarce yet never makes much over £100 a set, despite being as rare as 1934 crowns. A coin's value is an index of rarity * popularity, and usually that second factor is equally as important as the first. . . . I was surprised to hear that those LCA values are being set by Stephen Lockett. I bought off him many times at the Midlands Coin Fair some years ago, and his prices were realistic then, and in discussion with him, he seemed to be a very sensible dealer.

Barrington Smith in Leicester, suppliers to the trade, used to sell bags of assorted BU modern foreign coins for modest sums. Perhaps you could get a trade catalogue of them and see if they still do them?

scott, your "unknownfront" coin on Image Shack, is a Maria Theresa thaler, they've been continuously minted since 1741. In the Middle East until recently, certain States wouldn't trade in anything other than those as they knew exactly how much silver they contained. I bought a FDC proof at a coin fair a few years back, and it was pretty cheap. Beautiful coins though.

Now that one is interesting for being much cruder workmanship - less common I'd say. I have a 1916 shilling similar to that - no silver left on it, but it is exactly like a copper version of the real thing.

Somebody either knows a good forger or a good website! Nah, just great with Photoshop You really have F169 scott?

There may be a lot of truth in that - but it begs the next question, Who in their right mind is going to pay £10 to grade and slab a coin that is so common and so low value it defies belief? Well, quite. And as many serious collectors keep their coins in cabinets, they are the very people who won't be using the services of PCGS etc. Why pay good money to get your coin back in a wad of perspex that can no longer be placed in a cabinet???

But how can you ignore those prices? You have to ask yourself, who is a £20 1967 halfcrown or a £15 1966 penny aimed at? It can't be the likes of us, as you would hear us laughing all the way from the moon. So who, then? Gullible novices? I would have said London Coin Auctions were too reputable for that kind of scam. So who, then? It makes no sense, none at all. The more I think about this, the more baffled but also more annoyed I become. It's like they're either taking the mick, or trying to con someone as yet unidentified. I wish one of their representatives would come on here and give us the benefit of their thinking.

Why so many? If minor changes in design don't count then we have only one reverse and eight distinct obverses. It's really a case of what turns you on, and I'm afraid hyper-varieties just don't do it for me, I'd rather broaden my horizons and go collect roubles or something. If you have 500 varieties of penny, then that's fine if it's what you want. 120 does actually include a fair few varieties if you work it out. I'm sorry if I sounded a bit dismissive, I didn't mean to be, but for me a collection that I couldn't make interesting to a non-numismatist (and few would be enthralled by varieties of the 'pointing to gap or tooth' type) just wouldn't do. I'm with you there Red. I would like the 1897 high tide, and the 1903 open 3, but after that, the ones I REALLY want are impossible : 1922 with 1927 reverse 1933 1952 1954 !! I guess with buns, some people make a whole career out of the things, but I can only get excited by the more obvious variations.

There's a lot of contemporary silver-washed forgeries of that series. They aren't worth much, but they are interesting additions to a collection. The workmanship (if you ignore the metal) is often amazingly accurate.

That's a fair price, in both cases ! ? I would have said that nVF and NVF are the same? Just a matter of personal preference? But I'm willing to be corrected on that...

It looks distinctly possible.

Yes, the dies suffered weaknesses in those early bronze years - 1860 and 1861 particularly are notable for letters not fully struck up. What's more interesting is that lighthouse - it looks for all the world like a Saturn V about to blast off from Cape Kennedy

In the USA version of eBay, all identities are protected, except the winner! BC Same in UK eBay - if you look at the bids it just says "Bidder 1, Bidder 2" etc, so I'm not quite sure what was meant above? And here, even the winning bidder is anonymous. The only thing you can do, is click on each bidder's recent bids, though it doesn't tell you much really, except you can spot dealers who are bidding on certain classes of items and who have made 12 bids in the last hour say. But there is no identification, none whatever.

Thanks for that Mat - interesting, I don't think I'd have noticed that scam, but then it's not my expertise. I only have one Morgan dollar (bought years ago), late 19th century but strongly prooflike, with frosted design and mirror fields (I'm told it's not a proof though, but if someone had told me it was, I'd have believed them!)

Welcome to the forums damian The most likely explanation is that the coin was struck on a blank intended for another denomination (often in these cases, it's a foreign coin blank that's got into the wrong tub), and slipped through the inspection. As a curiosity it's certainly worth keeping.

OH MY GOD I've looked at London Coin Auction lots before, usually to depress myself how strict their grading is compared to everyone else's. Today I decided to have a look at their Coins For Sale .... DID I FALL INTO A PARALLEL UNIVERSE ??? Try this for size : 1967 halfcrown BU ----- TWENTY POUNDS 1966 penny BU ----- FIFTEEN POUNDS Who, outside a lunatic asylum, would pay that money for those coins??? And, to make matters even more surreal and bizarre - THERE IS PROVENANCE !! On a 1967 halfcrown??? On a 1966 penny ????? I must stop eating cheese before going to bed - it gives me these outrageous dreams Seriously though, to quote a certain Mr McEnroe, "they can not be serious !!!" There is something seriously twisted here, but I can't pin down what. Under no circumstances are 1967 halfcrowns and 1966 pennies rare, and nor will they ever be, in the same way as time has shown with 1758 silver, 1787 shillings and sixpences, 1887 Jubilee Head silver, Constantine bronzes, 1936 coins, etc ... once a glut, always a glut. But actually, their prices are demented right across the board, though none quite as insane as those 1960s items.

1950? I'd guess probably "yes", but I'm prepared to bet that there was some late George V and lots of George VI circulating around in high grade ... unless of course, the banks had started to pull them in after 1946, like they did after 1920. In which case, I'd say there were probably quite a few being harboured in tea caddies and drawers

If you look again at those two pennies, the wear patterns are a bit illogical - on the second, the date is more worn, but the H is just still visible. You'd expect with the extra wear that the H would be completely gone too. On the first penny, everything is gone nearly, except for the date numerals, which have lasted much better.

scott, the second example is a whole grade better than the first, really it is. I wouldn't look at that first example, but if I didn't have a 12H, that second one is good for a bid. It's the difference between NF and NVF (or GF+ if you're being strict).

Can you post the link please Mat?