DaveG38

Hi All, I recently picked up a few 18thC tokens in a job lot of coins that I bought and I am interested in identifying and understanding them. Can anybody recommend a good source book for this? I don't really expect to find a price guide, but some indications of rarity and variants etc. would be helpful. I've looked through several of the usual web sites and can't really find anything suitable. Thanks. DaveG38

Thank you very much mint_mark for this information. This has finally solved the problem for me. I would have used a copy of Krause for this myself, but the only copies in Kent of the edition that covers the 19th Century are at Canterbury library, and they have just closed this library and put most of the reference books into store for two years while they renovate the building. A great help!! Thanks again. DaveG38

Hi all, I bought a job lot of coins at a local auction recently and have managed to identify most of them. However, four of them have me stumped and I wonder if the forum members can help me out. Photos of obverse and reverses attached over two posts - my images are too large for them all to go up at once.

Thank you very much Scottishmoney. That's brilliant and very helpful. DaveG38

Here's the second set of pictures of the other two coins.

Scott Are you saying that there are two varieties of the 1954 farthing based on differences in rim thickness or that the 1954 farthing differs from the others in the Elizabeth II series? If the former what are characteristics of the two types in relation to the obverse and reverse. In other words, is it a matter of both thin and both thick, or are there four types with 2 x thin, 2 x thick, thin plus thick, and thick plus thin? DaveG38

Yes, but at least you get free P&P!!!!

Mat Its not much better at ordinary antique auctions. I went to the Canterbury one on Saturday and I couldn't believe what people were bidding on. In one case a small tub of circulated junk copper weighing no more than couple of pounds went for £150+ premiums etc. There was nothing at all in this at all, no lurking 1926 MEs or 1922 with 1927 reverse etc. just rubbish worth no more than melt value. The same was true for a number of other lots, all of which went way beyond my estimate. I did pick up two lots with some nice British Empire silver stuff in e.g. an 1835 Rupee in EF plus some interesting South Africa coins in the same condition from the 1890s, but even now I'm wondering if I paid OTT. I certainly see it being tricky to make a small return on them using ebay. I think the world's going mad and it must relate to the current economic climate. DaveG38

I am getting confused now. I always thought that this coin was found in a few Royal Mint Unc sets. Now it seems they are found in the Heinz set, the Martini set and possibly the Royal Mint Set. Can anybody say definitively where they are found? DaveG38

Probably not. I have found 2008 old designs for all the coins except the 10p. Does that include the old style 50p - this is the only on I am missing apart from, as you say, the 10p?

Hi all, Another daft question that I would be grateful for help with. Does anybody know what happened to the 'Coin Monthly' magazine. I know it started in 1967/8 and was still going around 1991, but I can't trace what happened to it since. I did wonder if it transformed into the current 'Coin News' but enquiries with them show that they are two different mags, and Coin Monthly was nothing to do with them. So does anyone know what happened to it, particularly which (if any) publisher took it over? Thanks. DaveG38

Hi all, Has anybody any ideas where I can get hold of an empty box for a 1893 short proof set. I've pretty much got all the coins now and am keen to find a box. Unfortunately, I have never seen one for sale and yet there must have been some about as its pretty easy to find the individual coins. Maybe they got destroyed when the sets were broken up, but I am hoping that one has survived somewhere and that I can lay my hands on it. DaveG38

Many thanks for the advice. I have tried emailing as many dealers as I can find, but no success, but plenty of offers to look out for one for me, so I live in hopes. I will also put a search on ebay to see if anything comes up. I have seen other set boxes turn up fairly often e.g. the 1902, 1911, 1927 and the 1937, but never the 1893. I'm not sure why. Were they made of card like the 1950 I wonder, so quite flimsy and easily damaged or what? As its pretty easy to find the individual coins, there must be plenty of broken up sets out there, but apparently no cases. The only explanation I can see is that the boxes were thrown away (sacrilege) when the sets were broken up. DaveG38

OK I give up - what's the difference between this one and the common ones? And before anyone says "go and buy a Freeman", I am trying - I get an email whenever one pops up on eBay but they always go out of my league! cheers Declan Declan, There are two basic types for 1909 penny, one with what Freeman describes as reverse D and the other reverse E. The reverse E type is the rarer one. They are characterised as follows: Rev D: • The waves to the right of Britannia are coarsely cut. • Britannia’s central trident prong points to a tooth. • The first ‘1’ in the date points to a gap between two border teeth. • Both legs of the ‘N’ in ‘ONE’ point to border teeth. • The uprights of the ‘P’ and ‘E’ in ‘PENNY’ point to border teeth. • Britannia’s fist, where it grips the trident is smaller and less spread. Rev E: • The waves to the right of Britannia are more finely cut. • Britannia’s central trident prong points to a gap between two teeth. • The border teeth are arranged so that the first ‘1’ in the date is centrally over a tooth. • Both legs of the ‘N’ in ‘ONE’ point to gap between border teeth. • The uprights of the ‘P’ and ‘E’ in ‘PENNY’ point between border teeth. • Britannia’s fist, where it grips the trident is larger, and more spread out. Less easily identified is the fact that reverse D has 167 border teeth whilst reverse E has 164 border teeth. Hope this helps!! DaveG38

I saw a 1933 penny come up on a Roadshow a few years ago - I think it was from a lady from Ramsgate or Margate if I remember right. The 'expert' was, I think, Paul Atterbury who expressed considerable doubt about its authenticity. However, he also commented to the owner that this date was often faked by welding together an English George V obverse with an Australian 1933 reverse! When I saw this I was unable to see how this would work, since the 1933 reverse is nothing like Britannia (unless I missed something here), but either way, in the end I couldn't see how this coin can have been genuine. If it were I think it would have been splashed all over the newspapers. Its also the case that there are a good many modern restrikes around which are pretty good and which get sold by a gentleman from Essex on ebay for about £14.99 - OK if you want something to fill a gap and have no chance of the real thing. Hers might have been one of these? DaveG38

I'm a little surprise that given the number minted there are no varieties especially as they managed 4 halfpenny varieties for that year Gary, You are quite right that there are no reported major varieties for this date. As part of my research for my book on 20th Century varieties, I investigated reports for the 1967 penny and was unable to find any major types - all being obverse 3 reverse J as per Freeman. However, there are many very minor types so maybe rcwiow could be motivated to go through them all, looking out for: 1. On a number of examples, particularly later coins, there is an incuse line below the helmet peak in the visor, which is at an almost exact right angle to Britannia’s nose. 2. Again, on a small percentage of specimens, the lighthouse is thicker, particularly at the top. 3. In a few cases, there is a stalk-like dot in the centre of the top of the helmet, which connects the helmet to the plume. 4. Some specimens have ‘missing waves’ in the left hand area of sea, along the edge and underneath the lighthouse. 5. Three varieties exist based on the length of the plume. a) Where the plume is longer and touches Britannia’s shoulder, the folds of the gown under the right arm are sharply engraved. On some coins there is a narrow gap between the plume and the shoulder and the folds of the gown under the right arm are again sharply engraved. c) A third type has a wide gap between the end of the plume and the shoulder with the folds of the gown lightly engraved. 6. Later specimens appear to have round punctuation marks on the obverse, whereas these are generally oval on earlier strikes. 7. Double striking of various date numerals also occurs. I don't know how or if these combine together on individual specimens. Real anorak stuff I know, but for enthusiasts.......... DaveG38

This really comes into the category of financial advice, but the received wisdom is that the gold price increases when times are tough. In fact it doesn't, it increases in value before times get tough, so you may have missed the boat to pick up a bargain. The FT are still singing gold's praises though, so worth reading this article; http://www.ft.com/markets/wealth/gold. This actually is what I distrust about gold coins, I think I can spot a bargain when it comes to a purely numismatic transaction but with gold there are so many other factors outside my control. On the other hand if the favourite comic of they who own the country is convinced, who am I to argue? Whilst not in the business of offering financial advice, the simple answer to your question is that it all depends on what you believe will happen to the $US in the future. Over recent months, the UK price of gold has increased considerably, but this seems to be largely caused by the sinking value of the pound rather than any spectacular increase in the value of gold. If you believe that the sinking pound will continue, then investing in gold may be worthwhile, although you are effectively currency speculating, if this is your reason. Overall, gold prices have risen over the past few years very nicely and had a short term spike up to $1000 per ounce at the height of the crisis, and have since sunk back. My view is that the future price depends on a couple of other basic key issues. Firstly, demand. Demand seems to be on the rise across the world, and the far east has a tradition of hoarding gold, right down to family level, unlike in the west. Gold demand also increases at times of financial uncertainty, and this factor might come into play in a big way if the US economy were to start to catastrophically fail, dragging the dollar down with it. After all, the value of the US dollar is based on confidence and if this were to start to ebb away, then the result could be a spectacular run on the dollar and a dash for gold by investors. If this happens, against a general increased demand then prices will go upwards. Will it happen? You pays yer money and takes yer chances!!!! My advice is get yourself a crystal ball and a good clairvoyant!!!

Hi All, I have now about finished my book on 20th century bronze coin varieties. However, I have a small issue that I wonder if anybody can help with. When it comes to decimal bronze, I have, I think, established most of the varieties for the 1/2p, 1p and 2p up to 1984 and I am aware of the two metal content types for 1992 and 1998, but does anybody know of any others covering the period from 1985 to 1999? Of course it may be that nobody has yet tried to find any, there aren't any to find given modern minting methods, or that nobody can be bothered - I must say that closely examining piles of similar coins can be very tedious! So can anybody help? Anybody know of any references to mags or articles on this subject? Thanks. DaveG38

Hi All, I am looking for an article concerning decimal bronze varieties and I wonder if anybody can help. The article was written by Iain WP Dracott and published in a magazine called Coin (Not Coin Monthly) for the period 25 Jan - 7 Feb 1980. If anybody has it would they be prepared to copy the article for me and email it or scan it? All reasonable costs would be met, as well as my grateful thanks. Please all rush at once!!! DaveG38

A coin which took my fancy when I first saw it and I have always wanted is the Elizabeth I sixth issue crown from 1601-2. I think its a combination of veneration of the age of the coin, the size, the excellent portrait and the fantastic detail for a hammered coin, which makes it so appealing for me. I have never got around to buying one (and they are pricey) plus the fact that I don't really 'do' hammered which has stopped me having one.

Hi all, Earlier in this thread, you may recall me detailing a book I was putting together on 20th Century Coin Varieties. Well, it's getting there, although I have split the book in two volumes, one to cover bronze and brass and the other silver/cupro-nickel. The main sections of the bronze volume are written, photographs taken and a structure put in place. I am now going through it, editing and researching new information to make it as comprehensive as possible and in doing so, I have found that I need some help, which I hope the forum can supply. I need a photo of the 1915 or 1916 penny obverse with and without a 'recessed ear.' I have looked around on the internet at various coins and I have been unable to find anything that gives me a clue as to what I am looking for. So can anybody help with photos I can use? If so then 300dpi is the standard needed and a close up on the 'ears' is all I need, not the whole coin. Obviously, due acknowledgements will be made when the book finally appears. Many Thanks. DaveG38

I have just failed miserably to add 'missing' coins to my collection. The last Lockdales auction, last weekend, had a number of rare date items, albeit in pretty poor condition e.g. 1863 florin in fair, a 1823 first reverse 2/6d in poor/fair etc. I put in some, what I thought, fairly generous bids, well beyond what I believed these coins were worth, and expected to pick up something, only to find that the realised prices were off the scale!! I am amazed. Many were beyond the book price for better grades and that's without the buyer's premium. In my case my bids were some 50-60% of the final price. Extraordinary. I can only think that there were some private bidders there determined to get the gap in their collection at almost any price. At this rate, I am going to have a long wait to fill these elusive gaps in my collection. Has anybody else had a similar experience? In this case, its not that I was outbid, its just the sheer scale of the excess paid that I find hard to beleive.

Chris, Details of the hammer price for those rarities I bid on and failed miserably as follows: 1863 Florin in fair at best - £420 1823 First Rev Halfcrown in poor/fair with a bend - £380 1841 Halfcrown in nF - £540 1816 3 Shillings in VF - £800 Coins I didn't need but still rare include: 1893 Jub Head 6d in fair - £120 1850 Shilling in fine - £440 1854 Shilling in VG - £130 1698 Farthing DIE in fair - £60 1854 Florin in G/VG - £310 1905 Halfcrown in GF with ek - £800 1849 Penny in VG - £150 These were the main rarities. Bear in mind too that all these are hammer prices without buyers premium, which for Lockdales is 12.5%. If you want any more data from this auction then by all means let me know. Regards. DaveG38

Not ddoherty_dog by any chance? I too am still waiting after nearly two weeks for a coin.

Thanks Chris. Nothing ventured nothing gained. I plan on making it for coins/numismatics only and I will advertise it in numismatic sites and magazines. I'm not going to give up my day job and I'm going to be realistic. I've had the logo,banners, advertising and business cards professionally designed but as you say I have seen auction sites come and go. I'm just hoping that many have reached the end of their tether and if it works it works, if not, so be it. I just want to offer collectors and dealers an alternative. I might be of interest for you, that there is a working german alternative to ebay concerning coins http://www.muenzauktion.com/ . Quite attractive for sellers, because they don`t have to pay any fees for there offers. Instead of that you can (but you don`t have to) let register yourself as a sponsor. In that case you pay at least 12 € (or 24, 36 and so on) a year. As a sponsor your offers appear minor or more often, when people are visiting the website. The side is used by amateurs and professionels as well. I thought about selling a few coins there, but I didn't, because I'm afraid, not many people are searching for British coins there (although you will find quite a lot). I have used this site a few times myself and have bought some very nice coins at reasonable prices so I quite like this site. The only pity is that I am now collecting early milled and not too much of that appears for sale.