Coinery

I totally agree. I'd much rather have a coin with even patina than with patchy uneven lustre. Take this 1862 penny (ignore the horrible scan - it looks great in hand; dark glistening virtually prooflike fields and such sharp edges I've sometimes wondered if ...) : it would value less than a BU example which I can kind of understand, but it would even fetch less than one with patchy lustre, which is just stupid. Just how I like a coin to look, and a good enough scan to see the sharpness of hair and fingers! I absolutely could not collect anything different. That's not to say I wouldn't buy different...I just wouldn't look at them and sail away to faraway thoughts and imaginings, as I often do with the coins I love! Thanks! You won't believe it, but I got that penny in the mid-1990s from the Midland Fair ... from a dealer who clearly didn't appreciate it : it was in his £1 box. Crikey, those days are long gone! Every joe in the street thinks he's won the lottery if he stumbles across any grade of penny in his grandma's sock drawer.

Not the best pictures, but it looks about there to me!

Would you mind me asking what your set-up was for the photography? One of the more difficult monarchs to photograph, and small denomination, well done, I'd say!

There is no officially laid down grading nomenclature but most people go with (in ascending order); Poor Fair F GF NVF VF GVF NEF EF GEF AU Unc. '+' and '?' are often thrown in just to indicate that it is (in the grader's opinion) better than or not quite as good as the stated grade. You will also come across 'Good' and 'Very Good' which are only semi-official in the UK although the norm in America and an attrocious mis-use of the English language actually being less than 'fine'! However, don't let me put you off from buying the book... Thanks again, and BU being the very top grade? Two more coins for members' grading opinions (if people don't mind?) Shame about all that nasty tarnish ;-) I'd pay £60 for a coin like that any day of the week!

I totally agree. I'd much rather have a coin with even patina than with patchy uneven lustre. Take this 1862 penny (ignore the horrible scan - it looks great in hand; dark glistening virtually prooflike fields and such sharp edges I've sometimes wondered if ...) : it would value less than a BU example which I can kind of understand, but it would even fetch less than one with patchy lustre, which is just stupid. Just how I like a coin to look, and a good enough scan to see the sharpness of hair and fingers! I absolutely could not collect anything different. That's not to say I wouldn't buy different...I just wouldn't look at them and sail away to faraway thoughts and imaginings, as I often do with the coins I love!

Sometimes you just have to accept what's available. This is pretty close to as it is. It's perhaps a little more colourful than in the hand, where it's velvety black. But it's also round, crisp and has the scarcer of the two reverses. Plus to my eye, it's quite attractive, though I can understand it's not to everyone's taste. I like it! Looks like it's been around a while...just as it should do!

I can totally see where you're coming from, and would not necessarily expect all my coins to be untoned, especially opre-20th century specimens, but for more recent examples, such as my pre-1965 US silver and George V silver, which I've so far mostly bought untoned, would prefer them to remain that way. I also agree some toning can be appealing, for example I have an uncirculated 1914 sixpence which has full lustre, but also a tinge of very attractive golden toning (was like this when I bought it), whereas the 1917 3D I mentioned has had some of its lustre now obscured by patchy black toning, which really doesn't look so great IMHO. Totally understood, even a nicely toned coin can look less desirable (to me) if it continues to tone...could quite possibly get patchy too. I guess, if I think about it, I wouldn't want a black geo 6 coin!

I really don't understand the BU collectors. I like collecting coins because of their historical significance, and the romance of times past, therefore I like coins to look their age and toning is that indicator. All that remains for me then, is to seek out the beauty in a coin which, of course, means well struck in the highest grade, and with as much lustre as possible, that has been overtoned in a balanced, and aesthetically pleasing way. This I think is the art and beauty of coins. I bought two duplicate copper half pennies a couple of year's ago...one was a totally unblemished full-lustre, and the other an overtoned coin, where the lustre was just shimmering through the toning, making for a richness in colour that had the impact on me of a stunning sunset. The sad thing is, the toned one was worth less as an investment which, as I mentioned in another thread, adds another dimension to the passion that is coin collecting, and is important to me. It's that aspect of living that we all enjoy, getting a bargain, part of collecting, I think! Anyway, my personal dilemma is, that to buy the very best, I have to buy coins that I don't actually like that much. I have to stick to the lesser valued toned uncirculated. Damn it, why doesn't the whole world value quality toned coins? Then THEY would be the premium prized coins instead!

I was told that coins being kept for any length of time in something leather such as a purse can cause this extreme toning effect. I'm not a 100% certain, but aren't sulphates involved in the tanning of leather?

Can anybody shed any light on the Davies Large Date on 1845 Crowns? Michael on his website discusses the dates with some good images http://www.michael-coins.co.uk/CR%201845%20dates.htm but suggests that the large date seems to be the commoner type, unlike Davies. I've been looking at a couple that I have, and they too have the large date, according to Michael's criteria. So, has Davies got this the wrong way round? How long is your date? Is there a different, even larger date that Davies is referring to? Probably not, given that the 'rarer' type only commands a 10% higher price tag. Any thoughts?

I haven't got Gouby, Nick, what does it say in there? Is it also suggesting that the large date is the rarer?

I had a couple of absentee bids. Was the bidding particulaly strong?

I made it but only looked at the Saxon and Plantagenet. I wasn't taken by those and so didn't bid. A nice atmosphere, as you say! You do hear of many stories regarding people switching the coins around. Numismatics is such a trust-based area that it's a real shame when people try to make a quick buck like that. Yes, I would be disappointed to hear it was common place, it would be so easy to switch for better grades, or better lustre, etc. I bought quite a few lots, and would never be able to put my hand on my heart and say 100% that the coin I got was the original one I looked at 2 hour's previously! Not after viewing a few hundred for the very first time on the day.

That would be a large date too, according to Michael's definition! Incidently, superb pad you've got there, great stuff! I'll upload my own residence next time the laptop comes out!

Thanks for that! It is that thing about being able to look over them with a glass of wine in hand every now and again, without thinking you're causing them any harm. Absolutely agree with the paper envelopes too, I also store a few miscellaneous away in these too!

Are there any of the damaging PVC elements present in the plastic windows of the L***t H***e sleeves? Does anyone know of any issues with lustre when using these sleeves long term?

Oooooooooops, didn't read the whole thread...didn't spot the highlighted 'back' tab on my phone!

Why doesn't somebody just message him/her? Just a thought!

sorry thught this forum was about coin's sould have gone to the stock market Isn't the inherent value/investment, and the swings and roundabouts of the prices, part of the whole experience of collecting? If you use a price guide to make a decision about how much to pay for a coin that you add to your collection, no matter how humble a purchase, then you too, even if unknowingly, are part of what makes the investment side of collecting coins what it is.

There are 200,000 out there serving 2,000 people who actually want one and another 20,000 punters who want a fast buck.Look at 1951 pennies there are probably 119,950 surviving of which 119,000 are UNC.They were £30 in 1965 and about £30 today.Buy an 18C coin avoiding 1758 1/- 1787 6d & 1/- any Lima coins...or maybe a book...investing in coins is very easy Hi Peter, I'm curious, is that really the coin market, just 2000? Or is that just the number of decimal collectors out there? I'm not questioning, but genuinely interested in the sources of these kind of statistics, as you will have probably picked up from some of my previous posts.

I'm wondering if it's possible to compile some stats on the following: I'm particularly interested to know whether building a website and getting it ranked is a fruitful proposition, aside from the prestige, when it comes to selling coins? Does eBay represent the greatest total sales for those who have both? What kind of % split would you say was an average? What about coin fairs, do the tables there justify their expense? Essentially, what percentage of revenue would you say each of the major outlets represents? I would be very interested to find out, as I have been building a site the hard way (using HTML & CSS) and still have a long long way to go to complete it, so would like to know whether I'd be better off focusing my attention elsewhere in the short term if sales are the aim, which of course they are! Thanks all!

Just a thankyou to let everyone know I really do appreciate all the effort that gets put into answering posts like mine. I'm really grateful, thankyou!

I should be, assuming everything goes to plan. Did you make it Historic Coinage? Did you see the two Ed VI sixpences? They had been switched around in their sleeves, made me wonder whether this was done by an unscrupulous viewer (being as the viewing is so open, and trust-based). Great auction, very impressed, a very nice family spirit, couldn't have been a more pleasant team.

Here's something Debbie, in the EdVII section on eBay...110801666410 Have a look see!

Like all good addicts; alcoholics, smokers, IV drug abusers, we always manage to find the money somewhere!