jaggy

Very few of the coins I sent for grading got a 'Details' rating; just six out of over 50. Most of the coins came back with pretty good grades and quite a few with MS65 or MS66. However, four of the six coins with 'Details' were bought from London Coins. That has damaged my confidence in buying from that auction house because I no longer really trust that their photos or descriptions are an accurate representation of reality. You may think that I am 'having a go' at LC but it is really up to them to instill confidence in the buyer. I know my field and I know what I am looking for. But given that I am buying coins based on photos and descriptions and do not have the physical ability, for the most part, to actually view them 'in hand' then I have to go on the basis of 'caveat emptor'. I will continue to buy from other auction companies such as DNW because I have zero problems with them so far.

Worth remembering that buyers (i.e. customers) drive business. If buyers are wiling to pay a premium for authenticated, graded and slabbed coins then dealers and other sellers will make that investment.

Everyone wants nice coins at a sensible price and not just in the UK. But we now live in an online world where collectors and dealers are buying on the strength of a photo and a description. But photos and descriptions can flatter to deceive. Having an independent and impartial TPG grade and slab the coin takes much of the risk out of the buying decision. And collectors are willing to pay more for that assurance. That is market reality in the USA and, increasingly, market reality in the UK.

Yes, and I made that point above. They lack independence.

That may be. But the point is that the business opportunity is there.

Yes, agreeing. NGC have an online 'registry' with 'custom' sets and 'competitive' sets where collectors and/or dealers can showcase their coins. From what I have seen of it, some of them clearly use that as an online marketplace.

It is coin buyers that drive the business. If buyers demand authentication, grading and slabbing and are willing to pay a premium for that then sellers - both individuals and dealers - are effectively forced to play along. You make it easy for the buyers and you make your money from sellers.

05.47am in Phoenix Fedex are expensive but they certainly seem efficient.

They probably recommend NGC for submissions (I don't know, have never submitted a coin there) but I have bought both NGC and PCGS slabbed coins from them. Point is, it doesn't really matter as both NGC and PCGS use the same grading system, have pretty similar grading standards and are generally accepted in the marketplace. So which one you use becomes a question of personal preference.

Mine passed through Memphis too. It is now in Phoenix.

I have come to the conclusion that third party grading is here to stay and that the market, even in the UK, is gradually beginning to demand that. Like I said above, nothing wrong with CGS trying to get into that market. I just think that they have done a rather poor job of so doing. The big two have a dominant market presence in the USA and not just with Heritage. The good dealers provide the certificate number so that the buyer can independently validate that the coin is what it is. At some point, they will expand into the UK and that will kill CGS if they have not established a robust market presence outside of London Coins. If I were running CGS, I would do three things right away. The first is that I would adopt the US numerical grading system so that there is no confusion for the buyer. The second is that I would make certificate lookup free so that a buyer can independently check the authenticity of a coin. And the third is that I would reduce prices for submissions in order to build market share. That of course will take some capital investment which they may or may not have.

DNW shipped my coin by Fedex today (better late than never ). They are estimating delivery by midnight tomorrow. So lets assume sometime on Thursday. It is still less than 48 hors from London to deepest darkest Arizona.

Nothing wrong with TPGs and nothing wrong with CGS trying to get into that market. The problem with CGS is that they are not independent - or not perceived to be independent - of London Coins. There is an inherent conflict of interest with LC's commercial interests which is of concern to the objective collector or dealer. The second problem is that they are heavily aligned with London Coins auctions as the primary outlet for sales. I had a look at the last DNW auction and there were 12 coins slabbed by CGS compared to 50 slabbed by NGC and 137 slabbed by PCGS. The third problem is that they use a different numerical grading system to NGC or PCGS. The fourth problem is that they have zero acceptance in the USA which is a huge market. Collectors buy slabbed coins because they take much of the risk out of buying 'sight unseen' or on the basis of photos. However, that means that they need confidence in the company doing the grading, they need a grading standard which is readily understandable and generally accepted, they need to be able to easily check a coin against the certificate number and they need a market where those coins are readily bought and sold (i.e. liquidity). I agree that slabbed coins are easier to sell than raw ones. If I choose to sell an NGC slabbed coin then I can pretty much do that anywhere. The same, however, is not true for a CGS coin.

I paid over the weekend and the invoice (under invoices) clearly states that it has been paid. Just waiting for the shipping info now.

£1900 Hammer.

Indeed! My 'win' was £400 over the high estimate; which I expected. Fortunately, it was under what I expected, and was willing, to pay.

Got the James II sixpence listed as 1686 ESC 773, I think it is 1686 - 6 over 6 & 8 over 6 - ESC774

Actually ... three sides. What he said, what she said and what actually happened.

I have identified a few sixpence lots that interest me. Generally have been happy with what I have got from DNW.

Are you able to share?

The estimate business is always a bit of a lottery. I won three lots at Heritage some days ago and all below the low estimate; two of them well below. So best to ignore the estimate, work out how much a coin is worth to you and take it from there.

That suggests that the estimates were on the light side.

Indeed. Atlas Numismatics, for example, includes post and packaging (within the USA) in the price. The actual cost to them is probably around $10 so fairly easy to absorb into their relatively high prices. Incidentally - and a bit off topic - I was tracking a coin in auction and Atlas had the same coin, same grade, same TPG. The bidding took that coin close to the Atlas price but when buyers premium, post and packing were taken into account, the auction price ended up at around 20% over Atlas. Always important not to get blinded by 'sticker price' but to take all cost elements into account.

In an increasingly global market, physical examination is not always possible. Auction businesses trying to expand their global footprint need to understand that. Confidence in the photo and the description become key business drivers. IT also explains the popularity of TPGs (at least in the USA) because it takes some of the 'caveat' out of the equation.

Auction houses are in business to make money. But in business, reputation matters and when an auction house starts to get a reputation for being a bit dodgy then their business is going to suffer. Some of the coins, acquired at LCA and that I sent to NGC were fine and got decent grades. But some did not. So the results were a bit hit or miss. But when you are paying out good money for a coin on the basis of the auctioneers photos and description then 'hit or miss' simply isn't good enough. Fact is, none of my DNW, Buckland Dix and Wood (remember them) or Glendinning's coins came back with problems. So, in the confidence stakes, I now perceive buying from LCA as being high risk. Will I buy from them again? Yes, but only if the coin has been slabbed or graded by NGC or PCGS. That, for me, takes most of the risk out of buying from them. I will not buy CGS slabs because 1) there is a conflict of interest with LCA, hence risk, and 2) they are not generally accepted in the marketplace. However, I will continue to use DNW and Heritage. I am also happy to buy from Spink and Baldwins if they can get the user interface right and have material I want. But confidence is a fickle mistress. Hard to win and easy to lose. Businesses take note.