ozjohn

Looking an the quality of the first series of George V silver the product from the Royal Mint is of very poor quality especially the florins with pronounced ghosting on the reverse, poorly defined lions in the upper shield on the reverse and poor detail on the effigy on the obverse some examples being so poorly struck that they would be graded as fine for an UNC coin if you did not know better. Looking at the Australian florins minted at the same time and same mint up to 1916 with the exception of some being struck at the Heaton mint these coins are of the highest quality and show no sign of being poorly struck. It has been said that the poor quality of British silver coins was due to WW1 diverting skilled labor into other industries but this is not apparent in the Australian issues in fact the quality did not really improve until the modified effigy appeared in 1926 while the low relief effigy of 1920 did little to improve the situation. However by 1924 the reverse of the florin seem to fully struck in the upper shield although the striking of the obverse was still weak. Maybe some of the issues with the coins after 1919 may be due to the alloy composition being changed but this does not explain the constant poor quality over this whole period. I guess this still begs the question as to why the output of the Royal Mint was so poor when they managed to produce high quality coins for Australia. Any ideas?

Interesting to read the report from the Melbourne branch of the Royal Mint where they had a Chinese general visitor who told the mint that shield back sovereigns were far more acceptable in the far east as the St. George reverse showed the dragon, the Chinese symbol in an humiliating positon. Just goes to show you can upset people without even knowing it. On the other hand I believe Greeks love St. George reverse sovereigns as St. George is held in very high regard in Greece. I wonder if the Chinese are still offended if they see a St. George reverse sovereign.

I was looking at some coins at a stall in our local market when someone asked the dealer about an British1865 penny. To which the dealer said it was worthless. As these coins were the circulating coins in Australia at the time they are part of the Australian series and the dealer should be familiar with the prices of such coins. The coin was not shown to the dealer so its condition was unknown. In conclusion dealers who behave as this one did not deserve to be told about a rare coin he may be selling at a low price as he is unaware of its value as it is self inflicted due to the dealer's ignorance .

I would give CGS a big miss myself. Their grading is too inconsistent and biased towards coins they are trying to push thru their retail outlet London Coins. As for rejecting "cleaned" coins CGS's attitude is completely unreasonable as all they need to do is note it on the capsule along with any other defects such as edge nicks/knocks etc. CGS coins for sale thru London Coins often have scratches digs etc. that do not effect their grading and are completely ignored by CGS "graders".

Not sure what integral to the life cycle of a coin means however cleaning a coin covers a simple wash with water thru scrubbing with steel wool. The decision to clean a coin must be taken on a coin by coin basis weighing up preservation issues, appearance etc. while minimizing the impact on the coin in question. Also with a caution if in doubt DONT.

It's all semantics. Acetone is still cleaning as it is removing dirt grease etc. from the surface of the coin. If you managed to scratch the coin whilst cleaning it with acetone the effect would be the same as any other medium put on the coin. The "cleaning" word seems to be misused in these forums as a way of putting down a coin. If there are obvious marks on a coin due to a cleaning process it doesn't really matter how they got there and the coin is damaged and if the cleaning process does not damage the coin in any way who really knows. I am not suggesting for one moment that coins shouldn't be cleaned with acetone but it is still cleaning as cleaning is the act of removing grease dirt etc. from the surface of an object. Perhaps we need to find a permitted cleaning agent and procedure?

I think a zac was a 3d and dinar 6d in Australia. Both survived as 50% silver coins until 1965. A shilling and two shillings were a bob and two bob. The halfcrown was lost in 1910 but survived as a circulating coin until the 1930s due to earlier releases and imports from the UK by migrants settling in Australia.​

I can remember prices in guineas in Australia in newspaper ads for posh shops as late as the 1970s long after the introduction of decimal currency in 1966.

Swanny, The hardback version of Rotographics for grading British coins is very good but if you have an iPad the Kindle version is very convenient for coin fairs and has the added advantage of being able to enlarge the illustrations for a better view. In addition if you can scan or photograph your collection you may be able to store a record of your collection on the iPad for reference for when thinking about a coin with a view of upgrading it when at a coin fair etc. It may avoid some expensive mistakes.

Sorry but I have to differ. With reference to Rotographics Standard Guide to Grading British coins I would grade the example of the 1924 sixpence at at least EF with the other example at UNC. I would give the higher grading as the wear on the King's ear is minimal and on the obverse the lion's nose has a similar amount of wear. As this is a 1924 dated coin the mint quality was beginning to improve and a coin in this condition minted in 1922 or earlier would probably be graded higher.

Neighbours or neighbors?

A most informative read thanks. WW1 not withstanding it still took a long time to solve a quality issue which did not enhance the Mint's reputation. Ghosting for example was a feature of Edward bronze coins.

Very nice.

Thhanks Paulus.

Excuse my ignorance but can somebody tell me what ESC is?

Recently I looked at the TV series Peaky Blunders and two things struck me. Firstly in the first episode people were playing two up in Birmingham UK. I always thought two up as an Australian gambling game. As most of the players were WW1 vets this may explain it as I am sure both UK and Australian vets would have mingled when on leave etc. Maybe two up is much older than I thought. For people who are unfamiliar with two up it is a gambling game based on the result of tossing two pennies . Secondly small change is showen in several episodes with worn Edward pennies visible. As the period for this show is 1919 they would still look like new coins! A blooper perhaps.

I saw the errors that were made by the spell check but I didn't have the heart to change them. They were too good.

Two up was serious business in Sydney where there was Thommo's two up school at Surry Hills an inner Sydney suburb in days gone past. There was the spinner who tossed the coins balanced on a strip of wood and a cockatoo who kept watch in case the coppers turned up. Two up is only legal on ANZAC day and in Casinos.

I can understand the mint's desire to enhance their profits by selling proofs but to describe their currency issues as dull is a little unfair. I have a 2000 currency sovereign which is very well struck from what looks like polished dies of which old style proof/specimen coins were struck with rather than the frosted proofs of today. High quality coins struck for general circulation with what looks like polished dies can be seen from both the RM and RAM's production.

The Royal Mint has a coin authentication service don't know how much it costs also it was rumored that they would keep the coin if it was found to be counterfeit http://www.royalmintmuseum.org.uk/about-us/historical-and-coinage-advice/index.html

That's a shame. I gave the name as Ray when it should have been Robert. Sorry for the mistake.

I agree an independent opinion is always useful. However I was wondering how CGS determine if a coin is genuine or not. There is also this web site that could help http://www.coinauthentication.co.uk/index.html . Ray Mathews runs a coin authentication service that employs scientific tests and may be of more use given the potential of the coin's value . I have no connection with this company whatsoever but I think the methods employed by this service may be more conclusive than CGS who again I have no connection with other than purchasing some coins from London Coins.

Experience!

Given CGS poor judgement in some of their grading what confidence is there with their judgement on if a coin is genuine or not? Do they conduct some special test or is it just weight dimensions etc. plus their experiance?

I can remember seeing a 1922 GB florin in gold at a coin fair in Sydney back in the 1980s. When I asked about it I was told that it was struck for Egypt which seems to confirm what has been said previously.