terrysoldpennies

Sorry I've not answered sooner, only she indoors took me on a rest from the pennies , something called a holiday . Anyway I digress , it seems some kind of experimentation was being undertaken by the mint during 1958 . I'm not sure of the types my self ,as the wide border type according to Freeman should have short teeth , where as I find them to all be longer. Gouby states that he can find no difference in the types , and so has not listed them. There clearly are a few differing types. You and I must keep looking, and see if we can find all of them. Terry

You've found one at last Richard . Did they know what they were selling , or was it a bargain. As to the Rarity , this is only the fifth in three years of me looking. Terry

As you can see from my findings , I only found one length of tooth on the wide rim type , so I would like to see some pics of the two types, if possible, as that would bring the total number types to five Terry

I looked at these variations some years ago, and sort of came to the conclusion that there might be four types , though the differences are so slight that it's hard to be totally sure, any way I scanned all of them and placed sections of all four together for comparison . Terry 1 has a narrow rim with the shortest teeth 2 slightly longer teeth with slightly wider rim 3 is very similar to 2 but the teeth do seem a fraction longer 4 has the longest teeth and widest rim

I just found just one of these in my spares box of about 80 1931s, and have noticed that it also has a dropped 9 which is distinctly lower than the other digits Terry

Rob . you could be right about the long Rs being first, though the thing is that the differing Rs seem to be the result of a die repairs rather than two distinctly different dies Terry

Ian . Fantastic close ups , with these pictures I notice the Ab Ac Ad all with the long Rs are all over cut on short R types. This seems to suggest the short R type with narrower dates came first . Terry

Nice find Matt . Looks like its doubled over a straight R. Your sample Dave suggests that all 90s pennies with the Short Rs are scarce . Terry

Hi Scott . It looks like from your count then, that the short R types in 1893s are Scarcer. I wonder if the rotated type will turn up on other dates, as it looks like the 1890 rotated is at the least very scarce. Terry

Has any one else come across one of these 1890 pennies with the rotated E in REG ?

Thats 3 , I wonder how rare they are . Terry

Hi .all the dot 1909s I have seen are of the speciman 1 type . I notice that its a different colour, which makes my wonder if like me on one of my pennies, the dot turns out to be a spot of weld on the coin. it would by a strange coincidence for a dot to be so close to the known dot position on the same date of penny. my one is below . Terry

As your all looking into the other dates with the two REG types ,I thought its a good time to announce the extra type I have found on 1890 pennies. The joined and separated types are there but there's an extra type with the E rotated to the right. I have pictured my well worn example and I have seen one other . Terry

Hi . its about three differing aspects to be found on 1889 pennies ,and which of the three are to be found together with each other . The three are :- the two established obverse die types, one with 15 leaves in Victorias hair, the other with 14 . Secondly some coins have REG with the R almost joined to the E , the other has a clear gap between the R and E. And lastly the six differing date widths , five shown in ALFNAILS picture, plus the new 14 tooth date width I have found, now listed as Bx . It does get confusing I must admit, I hope its been of some help. Terry

Richard there are other interesting variants along similar lines for other years which I'm still looking into . I will let you all know about them in the near future. Terry

Sorry to see you selling up Steve , best of luck . Getting on myself you see . Terry

Hi Alf / richard. That seems to follow my findings so far . I wonder if any C types will come to life with the gap. or B types touching. We will all have to keep a look out. I should add that the narrow date B types seem to have the extra leaf [ obverse R ] Terry

Hi Richard . That's what I was still researching . It seems to follow with the 15 tooth types, but the 16 tooth wide dates are type R with the extra leaf and the R and E are touching. So it will take a lot more coins with the extra leaf showing to make it clear which is which. Terry

Hi Alf - Richard . I suppose we must assume at the present time that the wide date types are all Obverse R, until and if others turn up on Obv. S , but here's the thing , all 1889s also have either R and E in RE G touch or with a slight gap , ie R E G , now I have be observing which of the types are present on Obv. S or on R , I haven't been observing them long enough to make a definite statement . What I can say is that all the 16 tooth coins I have seen all have the R and E touching, and the narrowest date types have the gap, but the common 15 tooth coin has both types. Now this is where a larger pool of higher grade coins needs to observed , and compared. Also on Michael Goubys site he shows type BP 1889 B as 14 tooth , but in his book the same pictured date is listed as 13 1/2 tooth , a mistake you may say , well I have found two differing narrow dates one 13 1/2 tooth and other 14 tooth. PS Alf I've hunted high and low for that large bag of 1877 narrow date pennies I put away , but no luck , let you have a few when they turn up Terry

Alf . I agree with all your findings, as all the examples I have seen have had obverse S with the extra leaf , but I have made some extra discoveries to the 1889 types . I have to go out now, but later today I will get back to you on my findings. Terry

I first saw this type nine years ago and started looking out for them , i've managed to by a good VF and one other , but the total count of coins seen in all that time is six. Terry

tell you what Dave,we'll all have to live 3 or 4 lifetimes to collect all the variations, just in rolled copper coinage alone Terry

The easy way to tell a obv. J or freeman 6 is first, the B of BRITT is almost touching Victorias head, and the D G colons after D point to the tooth, with the ones after G pointing to the Gap. Rev. d has a small island to the left of the Lighthouse which has a pointed top . also the P in PENNY points to the tooth

Hi bhx It is a j+d [Freeman 6+d] Terry

Matt, are you asking if its a polished proof , only I find that they tend to be very difficult to photograph , and the detail on this looks quite clear. I have the same problem with two of my coins . one is a 1967 penny which is extremely shiny but not quit as shiny as the 1953 I have. the coin was my mothers collected in the 1960s , and I am sure its not been tampered with. So my guess is that its a specimen strike. The other is a 1953 penny with a strange sheen ,not at all like a normal circulation coin, so I wondered whether its a matt proof , but it has the same number of teeth as the circulation type, and is not a known type, so its been suggested that I get them checked out by the mint, maybe if you feel strongly about your coin you should do the same Terry