What have I done??

[GateGateGo 8]

Well, it's hello from me and, as usual, in at the deep end.

Having spent the last couple of months arseing around buying new (ish) silver proof & BUC nonsense, I've decided that I'd much rather have coins with history. Unfortunately for me, I know sod all about the older stuff, yet suffer from trigger - happy self confidence (delusional, of course) so I thought I'd better join up here to learn summat whilst giving you lot a good laugh at the trash I'll doubtless end up buying from 'the bay that is evil' and other, sundry charlatans. 

I think I shall mainly be going for half crowns - crowns (and probably everything else at some point - did I mention I'm trigger happy?) so any advice / guidance y'all can manage between sniggers would be greatly appreciated.

 

Here's purchase #1, £16's worth of good, ole Victoriana. Or possibly, worthless old tat. You decide 

Regards,

Frank

 

 

[Nonmortuus 900]

Welcome Frank, being relatively new myself I can tell you that you have done the right thing joining here. Two of the best bits of advice I have had from members here were buy the book before the coin and buy the highest grade you can, EF and up where budgets allow. I can recommend the books Chris publishes here as a great starting point for learning about grades and ball park figures on prices. Just check the shop on the main predecimal page.

[TomGoodheart 402]

Welcome Frank.  A pic of the other side (obverse) as well would help I think.

The theoretical advice is generally.. (1) buy the book before you buy the coin.  Yeah, right.  (2)  Learn to grade coins (because price is generally related to condition)  (3) Buy the best you can afford. 

However we all make mistakes early on.  You need to buy, examine close up and see coins "in the hand" as part of the learning process. The best thing is try to keep the mistakes on the cheaper side.  Asking questions is good.  And buying widely is fine.  Most people end up specialising in some way, but there's no harm in getting to know about different denominations and metals.  And you don't have to specialise.  It's a way to keep the costs within budget, but your collection is yours and it's up to you if it all looks the same (quoting my Wife there!) or includes a bit of everything.

 

As to your halfcrown, it's not really my area.  However I'm a bit bemused by the extra line to left of St George above the 19 .. looks .. odd to me.  But I'll leave it to others to give an opinion.

[Paulus 1,975]

Hi Frank the Manc, a very warm welcome to the forum!

A few comments from me

• We do like a laugh on here, but you will not be laughed at or sniggered at for making the odd, inevitable, dodgy newbie purchase!
• Congratulations on choosing pre-decimal, both the Forum and the coins!
• So you are thinking of concentrating on half crowns and crowns, will that be date runs (will be very expensive) or just different designs (I collect all the different designs (or 'types') for all silver denominations from Tudor to 1946)? How far back are you thinking of going? Just English coins?
• Knowledge is the key, gained from experience, forums like this, and books. You will want an up-to-date price guide such as COLLECTORS' COINS GB 2015 (available http://www.predecimal.com/collectors-coins-2015-p-21018.html ), or Spink's Coins of England, and a book on grading, such as The Standard Guide to Grading British Coins: Pre-decimal Issues (1797 to 1970) just to start with. There are many other specialised books for when you get more into things.
• It is always best to put pics up of both sides of the coin. From the reverse pic, your new purchase appears to be around Good Fine perhaps, and if the obverse is about the same then £16 is an ok price for it.
• Try and buy the best example you can afford, you will not regret it in the long run

I'm sure there will be much more advice coming your way!

 

Edited December 30, 2015 by Paulus

[GateGateGo 8]

Thanks for the welcome, guys!

Yes, Tom & Paulus - a piccie of the obverse would deffo help - here it is. Unfortunately, I don't have the coin in my possession yet, so these are the sellers pics (hadn't realised the obverse didn't appear in my first post due to image size limitations). 

Yes, agreed that books are a must - I'll check Chris's offerings, Nonmortuus. Also agree that it's likely that'll I'll buy more before my book - learnin' kicks in, too

Whether I go for date - runs or types is largely a moveable feast right now, although I probably wont be going back in time any further than Victoria, at least for now, on cost grounds. Grading wise, I think that I probably need to learn 'the score' the hard way (and hopefully, with a little help from you guys too) - I guess thus far, I've bought on what looks good to me (I would've given this a 'fine+', so I'm a little off, it seems, but I'll get there!). Certainly, the intention is to buy the highest grades possible (preferably without breaking the bank!) although I'm sure there will be a few pitfalls / pratfalls along the way... Hadn't noticed that extra line above the 19, for instance, Tom. 

Regards,

Frank

 

 

[Rob 3,152]

That line isn't a problem, just a developed die flaw.

[GateGateGo 8]

Thanks, Rob. 

[Paulus 1,975]

Fine+ seems about right Frank, I don't think you were far off at all!

This is an example where if you spent a little more you would get a much nicer coin, as they are common in high grade. You will not find it so easy with the young head Viccy halfcrowns!

This is my old head example, which didn't break the bank (of course a lot depends on each individual's budget).Not the very best, and there are proofs too, but this is what I try and aim for, or better

 

 

[GateGateGo 8]

Purdy coin, Paulus!

Currently, there are two or three in appreciably poorer condition than 'mine' on ebay with higher starts than my 'win' bid, whereas something closer to your beauty would seem to be pegged around the £60 mark (as a 'buy it now' - none so good on open auction, it seems). Guess it'll take me a while to get used to the (to these novice eyes, at least) largish difference in value between F/VF to EF and above. Some pretty 'optimistic' grades on the 'bay as well, by the looks of things!

I suspect that I shouldn't have too much difficulty flipping this for a small margin when the time comes to upgrade, though - which, knowing me, won't be long!

Meanwhile, in lieu of books, I've sent myself square - eyed this evening searching for 'net - knowledge' before exercising that 'itchy finger' of mine again. Must get off my arse & go visit some actual, local dealers, too!

[Paulus 1,975]

Most dealers have an on-line presence (but still not all). It's always good to see a coin in hand before committing to buy. Rob Pearce (Rob on here) is a dealer I can thoroughly recommend in the Manchester area http://www.rpcoins.co.uk/

You will soon realise that eBay does not offer the high grade problem-free coins you will be after, except very occasionally ... and when it does they will not go for bargain prices! Worth a trawl if you can spare the time, and I still sell on there. Dealers, proper auctions and coin fairs for decent coin purchases.

 

Edited December 31, 2015 by Paulus

[GateGateGo 8]

Goddamnit, Paulus... 

Two minutes on that site & I've already mentally (in both possible senses!) spent the coming month's 'fun money'. Is this the same Rob who posted earlier in this thread?

Think I may be paying him a visit over the next few days - do you happen to know whereabouts in Manch he's based?

[Rob 3,152]

No shop, sorry.

[Paulus 1,975]

Slow down Frank, yes it's the same Rob who posted on this thread ... he helped get me on the straight and narrow about 7 years ago (when I was a newbie) and I have no hesitation in recommending him! He attends the Midland Coin Fair most months I think.

Send him a PM

Edited December 31, 2015 by Paulus

[Paulus 1,975]

You might also find it useful to browse on-line auction results and collections to get an idea of what's out there and prices realised.

Here's a link to my own collection (under construction), which includes many halfcrowns and crowns you may be wanting to collect:

https://pwcoins.wordpress.com/

 

 

 

[GateGateGo 8]

Alas, Paulus - I'm clinically incapable of 'slow', as my driving license and much else will attest! Still, it's one way of giving my liver the month off, I guess

Yes, research is the key and I fully intend to use every available source as I learn. I'll also be taking a look at your own site, too - although I'm sure it will make me weep with desire and cause me to look scornfully at my small, slabbed, silver Brit collection.

Rob: No worries, I see bank transfer is possible, so all is not lost! I'll likely confer with you either via your site or by PM here when I've given a lil' thought to what would be sensible (as opposed to skinting meself!).

[Nutsaboutcoins 105]

Hi Frank,

Welcome to the forum, you will soon learn, if you haven't already, that there are some very experienced people on here who are immensely generous with both their time and knowledge to help you out.

Happy hunting.

Ian.. 

[Nordle11 564]

Welcome to the forum Frank, there's not much to say that hasn't already been said but enjoy the back log of hundreds of great threads on here. There's a ton of info from some very astute and perspicacious members, I'm sure you'll have great fun.

[Coinery 1,153]

Welcome aboard, Frank!

Rob's one of the go-to chaps on here, and a gentleman to-boot, a gentleman and a scholar! 

 

[TomGoodheart 402]

The internet is your friend Frank.  You can search for examples of coins you are interested in to compare grades and prices, both on dealer sites and auction hosting sites such as CoinArchives  numisbids  or sixbid   You can ask for advice, here or on other coin forums (though this is of course, the best!)  And you can check out people's collections (like Paul's) for examples to use as a benchmark or to see differences in varieties.

I've bought from as far afield as Australia, America, Spain and Manchester .. all from the comfort of my sofa.  The people I've met have taught me all I know.  You can even read learned journals (see the Half-crowns of 1848 under Miscellanea:  http://www.britnumsoc.org/publications/Digital BNJ/1958.shtml)

Enjoy the ride!

.

[GateGateGo 8]

Hi, Ian / Nordle / Coinery, and thanks again to one and all for the warm welcome!

First books ordered, 'lil more online research done, trigger finger not overly exercised (although a rather nice looking 1887 half crown may be inbound).

Today, I plan mainly on attending to the 'debauchery' side of my interests, although I'm sure to be here tomorrow (c/w obligatory residual drunkenness and / or very sore head). Here's wishing you all a happy new year and, again, thanks for all the help & guidance thus far

Frank

[Stuntman 264]

Hi Frank, Happy New Year and welcome.  I'm relatively new around here too, having returned to collecting recently after a long lapse since boyhood.  

Sounds like you're already enjoying finding and buying interesting coins at sensible prices.  £16 for a really nicely designed, 116 year old bit of silver in perfectly acceptable condition is a bit of a result, really.  That said, I do agree with the advice others have already given about how it can be worth paying a bit more for one that's a fair bit nicer.  I bought a 1900 halfcrown about 6 months ago from the colincooke.com site which was graded GEF by them and which to me looked absolutely lovely for the price being asked.

 

As you might have seen in another thread in this area, I went to the Midland Coin Fair last month and would certainly recommend it as an experience in terms of getting to look at loads of coins, and asking questions.  I met Rob there too, and bought a coin from him!

 

Have fun collecting.  I agree that there's no need to have a theme or anything, but I suspect that some denominations or monarchs will naturally appeal to you more than others.   Personally, I wanted a decent grade example of every circulating predecimal denomination from the quarter-farthing to the crown, and a decent grade example of every monarch.  Ideally I would like a decent example of every monarch's bust going back to say George I, but that's probably too ambitious for my coin cash flow!

As a general rule for my coin cash and given the sort of collection I have, I would rather buy a better grade example of a relatively common date for a given type of coin, than a lower grade example of a rarer date.  However, for any general rule there will inevitably be exceptions, especially if those exceptions appear to be available for a good value price in my opinion.  As an example, I bought a 1905 shilling about a year ago from this very site.  It's 'only' NF/AF but is a good honest coin which I'm delighted to have.

 

 

[GateGateGo 8]

Hello, Stuntman,

Happy new year!

Yes, I understand The Midland Coin Fair is something of a must and I fully intend on going as soon as I can. I'm a complete 'noob', really - certainly in the pre - decimal field (unless we count the occasional 'find' of a pre '47 shilling or similar in my loose change as a lad), so my parameters for collecting are pretty open (for now!). That said, I think it may be wise to spend a little time at the lower end of the market (pricewise, rather than grade - wise) where mistakes may be easier to mitigate.

I too am pretty pleased with that 1900 Vickie half crown, although even a few days in, I'm already thinking of a quick 'flip' in pursuit of a nicer grade. That aside, I've bagged the aforementioned 1887 H/C which, if anything like the shots I bought off, looks very decent & I've also taken more of a punt on a '28 George V for peanuts. I shall, of course, report back when they actually arrive! Both, however, I believe to be in much better material condition - watch this space!

For now, I'm fixated on watching the shenanigans on ebay whilst trying (in vain) to lose the hangover. Even to these novice eyes, it appears much madness be afoot as fools seek to speedily part with their Chrimbo cash. Still, at least I know there seems to be a ready market for any mistakes I may need to recycle...

Cynical? Moi?

Frank

[Stuntman 264]

Good stuff.  Looking forward to seeing the new acquisitions, and happy recycling