NGC - Good / Bad / anyone got any views?

[Colin88 55]

Has anyone ever used NGC or got a view about them?

 

Thanks 

[PWA 1967 2,436]

I have never used them,but bought a few were the variety was not mentioned / spotted.

[Rob 3,355]

They are a good source for misattributions as a collector. No idea about the quality of service such as turnaround times though.

[azda 984]

Turnaround times Are about 6 weeks As they ship to The USA for grading. PCGS has an office in Paris where they do grading weeks, which starts tomorrow

[coinkat 21]

It depends what you are submitting- At first that my not sound helpful, but let my explain. If you have die variety or even a die variety that is a condition rarity, I would not likely submit it unless I confirmed with them first that they will recognize it and can make the correct attribution. And many British varieties unfortunately are just not recognized by either service. With respect to most coins through the reign of Edward VII that could grade MS64 and higher that are clearly attractive, I would submit. NGC is fine- so is PCGS. Don't loose sight of the fact that it is about the coin and not the plastic. Also keep in mind that the Sheldon scale and grading in general in the US is different that in the UK. Develop an appreciation of that difference.

[azda 984]

One other thing that i would add is that NGC are grade happy and many of their slabbed coins in MS grade would be more a VF to us, PCGS are a little more stricter and consistent, so if you are looking for high grade then send to NGC

[Colin88 55]

Coinkat and AXDA ......thanks for your replies .....good advice...

[Mark240590 3]

I've been considering which one to send my Gold Coast ackey too.. Based on this I may go for NGC. Of the day 10 slabs I have 8 are NGC, 2 PCGS. 

 

Has anyone found a decent way to post to PCGS it was more to post there than it was to have it graded ! Normally I like my coins raw but at the end of the day certain coins it is nice to have the slab to back it. Especially for resale confidence. 

[Nonmortuus 938]

I believe you can go through an agent , I am not sure if @mhcoins offers this service?

[jelida 1,437]

On 6/12/2016 at 1:13 PM, azda said:

Turnaround times Are about 6 weeks As they ship to The USA for grading. PCGS has an office in Paris where they do grading weeks, which starts tomorrow

I have to say that the young  French lady at the PCGS stall at the Midland coin fair was extremely pretty, I felt obliged to take a brochure and would have taken more 

Jerry

[Nutsaboutcoins 105]

she was only after your money 

[brg5658 111]

On 6/13/2016 at 6:33 AM, azda said:

One other thing that i would add is that NGC are grade happy and many of their slabbed coins in MS grade would be more a VF to us, PCGS are a little more stricter and consistent, so if you are looking for high grade then send to NGC

This is so blatantly false.  Get a grip man.  

"MS grade would be more VF to us"...?  

 Talk is cheap, let's see some actual evidence of your accusation.  Show me one such example of a truly no-questions VF coin in an NGC MS-graded holder, I dare you.  Most (i.e., almost all) lower-grade MS coins in NGC holders (MS60-MS63) would and do grade EF or gEF by British standards.  

Edited June 17, 2016 by brg5658

[brg5658 111]

Below is one of my apparently "VF" grade coins in an NGC MS63 holder... 

[brg5658 111]

Gosh, I guess this token below must be a VF grade, since when I sent it in NGC graded it MS63...

[azda 984]

4 hours ago, brg5658 said:

This is so blatantly false.  Get a grip man.  

"MS grade would be more VF to us"...?  

 Talk is cheap, let's see some actual evidence of your accusation.  Show me one such example of a truly no-questions VF coin in an NGC MS-graded holder, I dare you.  Most (i.e., almost all) lower-grade MS coins in NGC holders (MS60-MS63) would and do grade EF or gEF by British standards.  

Perhaps an slight over exaggeration, the meaning of which i meant as above that some of NGC grading is really poor. So for instance, an AU grade  This is what i mean, as i said above, if you want a good grade then send to NGC, if consistency in grade, then send to PCGS

 

http://www.ma-shops.com/worldmoneyshop/item.php5?id=310&lang=en

Edited June 17, 2016 by azda

[azda 984]

13 hours ago, jelida said:

I have to say that the young  French lady at the PCGS stall at the Midland coin fair was extremely pretty, I felt obliged to take a brochure and would have taken more 

Jerry

Ahhhhh you mean Florens Desbans, met her in Munich, she was a cutie 

[azda 984]

Here is my VF Shilling

[azda 984]

5 hours ago, brg5658 said:

Gosh, I guess this token below must be a VF grade, since when I sent it in NGC graded it MS63...

Oh gosh.....

 

Edited June 17, 2016 by azda

[brg5658 111]

6 hours ago, azda said:

Perhaps an slight over exaggeration, the meaning of which i meant as above that some of NGC grading is really poor. So for instance, an AU grade  This is what i mean, as i said above, if you want a good grade then send to NGC, if consistency in grade, then send to PCGS

Your opinion is interesting @azda.  I have collected NGC graded coins for well over 10 years, and have roughly 500 of their slabs in my collection now (and have owned many many more in my collecting life).  If anything, my opinion is the exact opposite of yours...as is the opinion of many other collectors of world non-USA coins.  PCGS' grading of coins may be slightly toward the lower end of grades (i.e., what people call "conservative"), but their consistency is horrible.  NGC coins may on average grade one or 0.5 points higher than PCGS' grading, but upon resubmission NGC will almost always regrade a coin exactly as they did the first time (i.e., consistency).  

 

The issue was so common and oft-repeated by collectors, that about a year ago I created a figure (see below) to graphically explain what we were all talking about on another forum.  So, PCGS may on average grade more conservatively (one point lower than NGC), but they also have a much wider spread of grades that any given coin may receive.  The issue with this lack of consistency in grading at PCGS is that, by the time a higher-dollar coin comes to market, it's often been submitted multiple times and is clearly maxed out grade-wise.  In summary, while NGC grades may be on average a little higher numerically than the same coin would get on average at PCGS, often coins in PCGS holders are maxed out at the top end of the distribution of possible grades -- thus ultimately over-graded.  I know, it's a conundrum/paradox, but my experiences have certainly supported this idea.

 

 

[brg5658 111]

6 hours ago, azda said:

Here is my VF Shilling

If you think that's a VF shilling, I'll buy it off of you for VF money...

The only way that coin is a VF grade is if the reverse is missing.  

[coinkat 21]

Interesting comments and examples. Within a grade such as MS63, there are going to coins that are high examples and examples that received the benefit of the doubt at that grade. Coins are not created equal. We often look at coins within a series a compare coin x with coin y and think- How can these be at the same grade? Collectors seem to look at plastic thinking that one service is better than the other. Even a comparison between the two coins may not be an "apples to apples" in that the coin in the one slab could easily be better than the other. So even though both coins make the same grade, it really is the look and quality of the coin and not the plastic that dictates the value. What is disappointing is that this concept seems to be lost on those that merely look at plastic and not the look of the coin which is far more significant. So the plastic discussion as tot he better service is really is nothing to get excited about- keep looking at the coin and understand why the coin is holdered at the current grade. Make a determination if if is truly a quality coin for the grade- if not, look for one that meets your expectations.

 

[VickySilver 923]

I agree with CK, certainly there is quite a bit of variance in quality at the same slab grade with even the same company. Also, some series they either don't seem able to grade or something - this would be my [sort of] specialty - matte proof silver of 20th C. 

 

One of my favourite dates of shillings - I think that one was a relative bargain when it came up for sale. Somebody went "big" for the MS 64 that came up same time.

[PWA 1967 2,436]

This sounds a really good oportunity.

1. The comments are they overgrade....... ....i need to sell a few.

2. They dont reject many and are happy for coins to have VERD/CORROSION/EDGE KNOCKS....etc.

3. Everyone in America loves them 

4.Turnaround is quick.........

5. Heritage will put them straight in the auction.........Good % deal 

5. They dont bother about varieties .......even if you tell them.........

 

Mine are currently on there way and will be sold through HERITAGE soon.

Maybe  i can find someone to buy a couple.

Fingers crossed.

Pete.

[VickySilver 923]

Pete, if they are rare bits with a high grade then in all likelihood you'd be pleased.

 

PS - Can you give us a hint as to what they are?

Edited June 19, 2016 by VickySilver

[azda 984]

On 17 June 2016 at 4:04 PM, brg5658 said:

Your opinion is interesting @azda.  I have collected NGC graded coins for well over 10 years, and have roughly 500 of their slabs in my collection now (and have owned many many more in my collecting life).  If anything, my opinion is the exact opposite of yours...as is the opinion of many other collectors of world non-USA coins.  PCGS' grading of coins may be slightly toward the lower end of grades (i.e., what people call "conservative"), but their consistency is horrible.  NGC coins may on average grade one or 0.5 points higher than PCGS' grading, but upon resubmission NGC will almost always regrade a coin exactly as they did the first time (i.e., consistency).  

 

The issue was so common and oft-repeated by collectors, that about a year ago I created a figure (see below) to graphically explain what we were all talking about on another forum.  So, PCGS may on average grade more conservatively (one point lower than NGC), but they also have a much wider spread of grades that any given coin may receive.  The issue with this lack of consistency in grading at PCGS is that, by the time a higher-dollar coin comes to market, it's often been submitted multiple times and is clearly maxed out grade-wise.  In summary, while NGC grades may be on average a little higher numerically than the same coin would get on average at PCGS, often coins in PCGS holders are maxed out at the top end of the distribution of possible grades -- thus ultimately over-graded.  I know, it's a conundrum/paradox, but my experiences have certainly supported this idea.

 

 

Do you have hammered coins @brg5658 this is where in my opinion the inconsistencies occur, i don't think NGC quite have the grasp of these as per the link i posted above, i've seen extremely high grades in hammered coinage but for the life of me cannot get past the fact that hammered coins can't ever be UNC because of the crudeness of striking. I've just had 3 done at PCGS (not hammered) and had MS65, PF66 and MS63, (first 2 finest known) although the MS65 i thought may have been better but i'm not going to complain about it, i wanted to compare the 65 against the NGC 65s of which there are 3 with none finer but cannot find them so if you can find and anything it would be good to compare.