Half Pennies - confirmation of Variety help please?

[Paddy 1,830]

As mentioned in a different thread, I came across a bunch of reasonably decent Victorian Half Pennies recently, which I hope have provided me with some variety fillers and some upgrades. 

I think I have identified them all, but I hope one of you experts might be able to have a glance over the following 5 1861 coins and let me know if I have them right?

ONE - I have this down as 7+G - 7 because no incuse lines in the leaves and the extra leaf present, G because of the lighthouse door:

 

[Paddy 1,830]

TWO - I have down as 6+G - 6 because most leaves have the double incuse lines, G as before because of the lighthouse door.

 

[Paddy 1,830]

THREE - I have this as 6+E - 6 as before and E because it has the LCW above the date:

 

[Paddy 1,830]

FOUR - I have this as 5+E - fewer incuse lines on the leaves, also die fault on the forehead,  and the same LCW on the reverse.

 

Edited June 19, 2018 by Paddy
More info

[Paddy 1,830]

FIVE - I have this as 4+G - no incuse lines but too few leaves to be a 7, reverse with the door on the lighthouse:

[zookeeperz 470]

Can't help you Paddy apart from obverse 7 all the others look exactly the same to me and tbh bare no resemblance to the pics in the book. Horrible series to identify.  

[DrLarry 443]

I have hundreds of 1861's paddy so I will take a look for you it is one of the most exciting half penny years so full of errors and changes but even after looking at it for three years now only one seriously, I find it really hard to get good information apart from Peck and freeman. I will compare it with mine if I get time today. 

[Paddy 1,830]

  On 6/20/2018 at 7:11 AM, DrLarry said:

I have hundreds of 1861's paddy so I will take a look for you it is one of the most exciting half penny years so full of errors and changes but even after looking at it for three years now only one seriously, I find it really hard to get good information apart from Peck and freeman. I will compare it with mine if I get time today. 

Thanks for that @DrLarry - I want to put these away in my collection but I want to be sure I have them right before I do so. Any comments welcome. It is long overdue for someone to do a thorough website on the Half Penny - I have neither the knowledge nor a good enough collection (yet).

 

[DrLarry 443]

OK I will take a look at your 61's I particularly like the round lighthouse type so I will investigate for you soon. I'm going over to the lakes tomorrow or up the Northumberland coast if the sun might shine... A rare thing so I can get some paintings prepared. 

[DrLarry 443]

  On 6/19/2018 at 3:11 PM, Paddy said:

As mentioned in a different thread, I came across a bunch of reasonably decent Victorian Half Pennies recently, which I hope have provided me with some variety fillers and some upgrades. 

I think I have identified them all, but I hope one of you experts might be able to have a glance over the following 5 1861 coins and let me know if I have them right?

ONE - I have this down as 7+G - 7 because no incuse lines in the leaves and the extra leaf present, G because of the lighthouse door:

 

The I in Victoria is over a smaller I and the 1 in the date is over punched. I find it intriguing that the lettering has often been altered from the older curly bases to the straighter more solid type. The F of half looks to have been repaired almost looks like a an I I have noticed it often looses the lower serif and the base. 

[Rob 3,185]

1 to 4 look to be as stated. no.5 I can't tell for certain but the leaves at the top of the wreath are in the right place. 

[Paddy 1,830]

  On 6/20/2018 at 9:04 PM, Rob said:

1 to 4 look to be as stated. no.5 I can't tell for certain but the leaves at the top of the wreath are in the right place. 

Thanks @Rob that's what I need most - confirmation of the basic variety before we get into variations on variations! 

[Rob 3,185]

  On 6/20/2018 at 9:26 PM, Paddy said:

Thanks @Rob that's what I need most - confirmation of the basic variety before we get into variations on variations! 

It would be a lot easier if some were a bit more presentable. The temptation to store nos. 4 & 5 under the felt instead of on top must be immense.

[Paddy 1,830]

  On 6/20/2018 at 10:00 PM, Rob said:

It would be a lot easier if some were a bit more presentable. The temptation to store nos. 4 & 5 under the felt instead of on top must be immense.

I know what you mean! I have always worked on the basis of putting anything that ticks the box into the collection for now and then work on upgrades as the opportunity arises. It has served me alright so far and as they are in an album, I don't have to look at them every day.

Thanks again for the review - that has cleared up the query for me. (And I am pleased I am beginning to get some of them right!)

[DrLarry 443]

  On 6/19/2018 at 3:45 PM, Paddy said:

FOUR - I have this as 5+E - fewer incuse lines on the leaves, also die fault on the forehead,  and the same LCW on the reverse.

 

I find this flaw on the forehead fascinating it is one of the crazy things I want to find an answer to that is not "it is as it is !!" 

[DrLarry 443]

well thank you however for making a feature out of the half pennies it has been nice to have a look for a few things again.  I will list a few more things adding to this section on half pennies if you do not mind.  I have realised that sometimes it is better to keep a thread going than to start a new one.  Let me know if you have found a new species, I in a rather mad way see them as extinct species and we are piecing together the phylogeny.  

[Paddy 1,830]

  On 6/21/2018 at 8:56 AM, DrLarry said:

well thank you however for making a feature out of the half pennies it has been nice to have a look for a few things again.  I will list a few more things adding to this section on half pennies if you do not mind.  I have realised that sometimes it is better to keep a thread going than to start a new one.  Let me know if you have found a new species, I in a rather mad way see them as extinct species and we are piecing together the phylogeny.  

Feel free to add away! For my part, I have achieved my aim here for now in confirming which varieties of 1861 I have. (The two I had in my collection have both been amended too - I believe I now have six of the Freeman varieties for this year.) I have one more batch of Halfpennies due in the post - I will post any oddities amongst those once I have got them.

As to the flaw on Victoria's head on number FOUR above - that is a recognised feature of obverse 5 according to Freeman occurring on "most" specimens...

 

[DrLarry 443]

Yes , but you know me I always want to know "WHY?" I must have been a terrible child asking that all the time....no wonder my parents sold me at 8 years old