1806 imperfect 1 and zero only found in proof penny?

[SilverAge3 80]

The 1806 pennies with imperfect 1 and 0 -- 1 missing the base, and 0 open at top -- are only to be found in proof issues, not currency, is that correct?  Just clarifying for my own records. Thanks.

 

Edited January 3, 2024 by SilverAge3

[secret santa 2,325]

Yes, on P1325, 1326, 1327 and an unrecorded mule (which I own an example of).

See my website - https://headsntails14.wordpress.com/george-iii-1805-06-patterns-proof-restrikes/

[SilverAge3 80]

Thanks for the confirmation, and thanks again for your website, that page is one I had not yet trekked down, and not just the unrecorded mule, but many of the mules I was unaware of. Fascinating.

Follow up question, @secret santa, is the distinction between P1326 and 1327 going to be discernable by assuming the bronzed ones will have darker chocolate fields, generally? I suspect I own the copper, not bronzed, but looking to verify. I'll try to upload pics, but often max out beyond constraints... I was able to get one up, which hopefully suffices, but can try to compress other images without destroying purpose of uploading them.

Thanks again for your input.

Edited January 3, 2024 by SilverAge3

[Rob 3,152]

Looks copper to me. Bronzed pieces tend to have much more uniform colour. e.g. this less than perfect bronzed proof penny is still obviously monochromatic underneath the imperfections.

[SilverAge3 80]

Thanks for the confirmation.

[secret santa 2,325]

I agree that it looks like copper.

Bronzed specimens tend to look a browny-pink (see below)

.

 

[Paddy 1,720]

@SilverAge3 - tips on uploading pictures: In each post the limit is 0.49MB as shown, so first of all shrink each image down to that size. The main point is that if you try to immediately post a second time in the same thread, it will tell you can't because you have reached the limit, BUT if you come out of the thread and then back in, it will then let you load another image.

[SilverAge3 80]

2 minutes ago, Paddy said:

@SilverAge3 - tips on uploading pictures: In each post the limit is 0.49MB as shown, so first of all shrink each image down to that size. The main point is that if you try to immediately post a second time in the same thread, it will tell you can't because you have reached the limit, BUT if you come out of the thread and then back in, it will then let you load another image.

thanks for that tip

[SilverAge3 80]

I'm not trying to disparage any dealers validity, or anything, I have a lot to learn, but this thread confirms more what I thought bronzed proofs typically looked like, so with that said, I had wondered about these two 1806 proofs (these do not have imperfect 1 and 0, obv), as they looked less like I thought bronzed proofs might. Granted photos can dramatically alter coin appearances, but curious on others' thoughts.  I'm just trying to learn, so pardon the ignorance.

I'll upload across a couple more comments, as site's being finicky. 

Edited January 3, 2024 by SilverAge3

[SilverAge3 80]

[SilverAge3 80]

[Rob 3,152]

15 minutes ago, secret santa said:

Bronzed specimens tend to look a browny-pink (see below).

There is quite a lot of variation in the colour of bronzed proofs. Soho and Royal Mint bronzing is normally darker than Taylor's restrikes, which can be a bit blotchy in nature.

[Rob 3,152]

In the case of the two coins pictured above, the photo has been done so as to maximise the reflectivity of the field and produce as much of a cameo effect as possible. That doesn't help to show the colour as in hand. Lighting angle, picture angle, surface reflectivity all combine to give a multitude of options. This pattern halfpenny is really dark in hand, but lit from a certain angle is like an oil painting. 

[SilverAge3 80]

Thanks for the feedback. Photos really can alter a coin's appearance.

[SilverAge3 80]

As an aside, what does Selig 1305 refer to?

[Rob 3,152]

Just now, SilverAge3 said:

As an aside, what does Selig 1305 refer to?

Selig collection of coins sold at Spink on 2nd March 1999. That coin was lot 1305 - see attached image from catalogue. And thanks for asking the question as I discovered my chimney has a leak, soaking the edge of the catalogues for sales 127 to 133. It's been wet recently.

[SilverAge3 80]

2 minutes ago, Rob said:

 And thanks for asking the question as I discovered my chimney has a leak, soaking the edge of the catalogues for sales 127 to 133. It's been wet recently.

 

Glad to be , sorry your lit has suffered water damage, hopefully it can be mitigated. I prize my reference books for all my interests, and lost some things along the way, it's no fun.

[secret santa 2,325]

Here are 2 1806 pennies, both sold as F1328 Bronzed - compare the colours !

[Paddy 1,720]

Surely those are two pictures of the same coin? The spots all match exactly, only the colour is different?

[secret santa 2,325]

Exactly. You just can't rely on photographs to reflect reality.

Edited January 3, 2024 by secret santa

[mrbadexample 1,006]

6 hours ago, SilverAge3 said:

I'm not trying to disparage any dealers validity, or anything, I have a lot to learn, but this thread confirms more what I thought bronzed proofs typically looked like, so with that said, I had wondered about these two 1806 proofs (these do not have imperfect 1 and 0, obv), as they looked less like I thought bronzed proofs might. Granted photos can dramatically alter coin appearances, but curious on others' thoughts.  I'm just trying to learn, so pardon the ignorance.

I'll upload across a couple more comments, as site's being finicky. 

I think Colin Cooke should be reliable.