Ebay's Worst Offerings

[Rob 3,152]

That's crap. It isn't even good enough for a museum copy.

[HistoricCoinage 146]

It's not like any copy I've seen - WRL, Grunal or otherwise. My bet would be someone messing around with dies.

[Coinery 1,156]

It's not like any copy I've seen - WRL, Grunal or otherwise. My bet would be someone messing around with dies.

I really do fancy having a little play at that myself sometime! I'm going to try and catch Dave Moneyer over the summer if I can, would be an interesting meeting?

[HistoricCoinage 146]

It's not like any copy I've seen - WRL, Grunal or otherwise. My bet would be someone messing around with dies.

I really do fancy having a little play at that myself sometime! I'm going to try and catch Dave Moneyer over the summer if I can, would be an interesting meeting?

Oh it would be! I've stayed at his place a couple of times and messed around with the blanks, dies and hammers. Never a dull moment with Dave!

Hopefully that piece of junk will be off eBay by the close of tomorrow.

[Rob 3,152]

1806 Proof Halfpenny

Yeh, right. I've asked which Peck number it is. I suspect the follow-up question will be are you a complete twat or just a partial one? But - must give the benefit of the doubt until proven otherwise. Another example from Dundee's finest.

[Coinery 1,156]

1806 Proof Halfpenny

Yeh, right. I've asked which Peck number it is. I suspect the follow-up question will be are you a complete twat or just a partial one? But - must give the benefit of the doubt until proven otherwise. Another example from Dundee's finest.

That was much better than I was expecting from our Tommy!

[Rob 3,152]

1806 Proof Halfpenny

Yeh, right. I've asked which Peck number it is. I suspect the follow-up question will be are you a complete twat or just a partial one? But - must give the benefit of the doubt until proven otherwise. Another example from Dundee's finest.

That was much better than I was expecting from our Tommy!

Yes, but it's currency and worth a tenner, or about 300 less than he is asking. That's a huge markup.

Edited May 19, 2013 by Rob

[Rob 3,152]

I've had a reply of sorts.

There are within a mintage two type of coins. Normally, the presses mint the coins for circulation. However, within the quantities minted, there are certain items (analysis) which are extremely brilliant uncirculated, on both sides, with are put a side and designed as Proofs, and values will be increased with an eye on profit and interested collectors. Long type ago, the mints were using the word Proof inserted on the coin. However, when sets were solely minted for that effect, due to its limitation (not higher on Proof results) but short on general presentation, they were melted down. Now, regarding the bronzed coin listed above, shall I correct your quote "…no berries…" and clarify that the coin has 10 berries on 'Britannia". Also, there are only a single bronzed Proof coins on 1806. Further more, also unique, the "soho" incuse and a small ship. Nearly identical design on the Farthing. Last, but not least, Penny, 1/2 Penny and Farthing were part of the Fourth Issue uniquely minted by Soho Mint (Birmingham), all coins were minted as die axis. Regards.

- yestodtom

I have replied correcting each point in turn, finally explaining that I am dealing with a complete twat.

[Paulus 1,975]

I've had a reply of sorts.

There are within a mintage two type of coins. Normally, the presses mint the coins for circulation. However, within the quantities minted, there are certain items (analysis) which are extremely brilliant uncirculated, on both sides, with are put a side and designed as Proofs, and values will be increased with an eye on profit and interested collectors. Long type ago, the mints were using the word Proof inserted on the coin. However, when sets were solely minted for that effect, due to its limitation (not higher on Proof results) but short on general presentation, they were melted down. Now, regarding the bronzed coin listed above, shall I correct your quote "…no berries…" and clarify that the coin has 10 berries on 'Britannia". Also, there are only a single bronzed Proof coins on 1806. Further more, also unique, the "soho" incuse and a small ship. Nearly identical design on the Farthing. Last, but not least, Penny, 1/2 Penny and Farthing were part of the Fourth Issue uniquely minted by Soho Mint (Birmingham), all coins were minted as die axis. Regards.

- yestodtom

I have replied correcting each point in turn, finally explaining that I am dealing with a complete twat.

Rob please forgive me but I did belly laugh at his reply! Ignoring the many factual inaccuracies, is it remotely possible that English is his 5th language and he used various on-line translation apps to convert from Mandarin -> Vulcan -> Swahili -> Yoda and then into pigeon English? I would love to read your reply to him! :D

[Coinery 1,156]

I've had a reply of sorts.

There are within a mintage two type of coins. Normally, the presses mint the coins for circulation. However, within the quantities minted, there are certain items (analysis) which are extremely brilliant uncirculated, on both sides, with are put a side and designed as Proofs, and values will be increased with an eye on profit and interested collectors. Long type ago, the mints were using the word Proof inserted on the coin. However, when sets were solely minted for that effect, due to its limitation (not higher on Proof results) but short on general presentation, they were melted down. Now, regarding the bronzed coin listed above, shall I correct your quote "…no berries…" and clarify that the coin has 10 berries on 'Britannia". Also, there are only a single bronzed Proof coins on 1806. Further more, also unique, the "soho" incuse and a small ship. Nearly identical design on the Farthing. Last, but not least, Penny, 1/2 Penny and Farthing were part of the Fourth Issue uniquely minted by Soho Mint (Birmingham), all coins were minted as die axis. Regards.

- yestodtom

I have replied correcting each point in turn, finally explaining that I am dealing with a complete twat.

Rob please forgive me but I did belly laugh at his reply! Ignoring the many factual inaccuracies, is it remotely possible that English is his 5th language and he used various on-line translation apps to convert from Mandarin -> Vulcan -> Swahili -> Yoda and then into pigeon English? I would love to read your reply to him! :D

Yes, c'mon, Rob! Let's hope he doesn't get it into his head to rook a brite one day!

Edit: sorry, Wook a brite! Oh, dear!

Edited May 23, 2013 by Coinery

[Hussulo 6]

£93 for this

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rare-1823-A-D-King-George-IIII-Gold-Sovereign-Type-Coin-Contemporary-Forgery-/140975633320?pt=UK_Coins_BritishMilled_RL&hash=item20d2cd73a8&autorefresh=true

[Rob 3,152]

'I'm sorry, but you haven't the slightest idea what you are talking about. What you have written is complete nonsense. You need a copy of the standard reference English Copper, Tin and Bronze Coins in the British Museum 1558-1958. Douglas Saville in Reading has a copy available for £95 on his website. Buy it, read it and then you will be equipped to discuss whether you have a proof or not. One of the benefits you will gain is the ability to differentiate between leaves and berries. You will also find which coin types have which die axis. You will discover that with the exception of one die where the ship has nearly worn away, all have a ship. You will discover that there are 9 types of bronzed proof listed by Peck in the book. You will find that the garbage you have written about the proofs being melted down and being unique is complete tosh. You will find which type of edge the various proofs and currency coins have. You will also find that the obverse of your coin matches the normal currency die characteristics and is nothing like the detail found on the proofs. What you have is a VF currency coin with 10 leaves and no berries. I collect George III pattern and proof halfpennies. Do everyone a favour and revise the listing to reflect what you are selling. There is a danger that an inexperienced collector may buy this in the misguided belief that they have a proof and will be about £300 out of pocket thanks to your deception.'

[Coinery 1,156]

'I'm sorry, but you haven't the slightest idea what you are talking about. What you have written is complete nonsense. You need a copy of the standard reference English Copper, Tin and Bronze Coins in the British Museum 1558-1958. Douglas Saville in Reading has a copy available for £95 on his website. Buy it, read it and then you will be equipped to discuss whether you have a proof or not. One of the benefits you will gain is the ability to differentiate between leaves and berries. You will also find which coin types have which die axis. You will discover that with the exception of one die where the ship has nearly worn away, all have a ship. You will discover that there are 9 types of bronzed proof listed by Peck in the book. You will find that the garbage you have written about the proofs being melted down and being unique is complete tosh. You will find which type of edge the various proofs and currency coins have. You will also find that the obverse of your coin matches the normal currency die characteristics and is nothing like the detail found on the proofs. What you have is a VF currency coin with 10 leaves and no berries. I collect George III pattern and proof halfpennies. Do everyone a favour and revise the listing to reflect what you are selling. There is a danger that an inexperienced collector may buy this in the misguided belief that they have a proof and will be about £300 out of pocket thanks to your deception.'

No mincing there, then, Rob! Honestly, just his attempts to bamboozle was deserving of your response, he can't truly believe a word of it himself? Surely, no-one's THAT delusional...are they?

[Paulus 1,975]

'I'm sorry, but you haven't the slightest idea what you are talking about. What you have written is complete nonsense. You need a copy of the standard reference English Copper, Tin and Bronze Coins in the British Museum 1558-1958. Douglas Saville in Reading has a copy available for £95 on his website. Buy it, read it and then you will be equipped to discuss whether you have a proof or not. One of the benefits you will gain is the ability to differentiate between leaves and berries. You will also find which coin types have which die axis. You will discover that with the exception of one die where the ship has nearly worn away, all have a ship. You will discover that there are 9 types of bronzed proof listed by Peck in the book. You will find that the garbage you have written about the proofs being melted down and being unique is complete tosh. You will find which type of edge the various proofs and currency coins have. You will also find that the obverse of your coin matches the normal currency die characteristics and is nothing like the detail found on the proofs. What you have is a VF currency coin with 10 leaves and no berries. I collect George III pattern and proof halfpennies. Do everyone a favour and revise the listing to reflect what you are selling. There is a danger that an inexperienced collector may buy this in the misguided belief that they have a proof and will be about £300 out of pocket thanks to your deception.'

No mincing there, then, Rob! Honestly, just his attempts to bamboozle was deserving of your response, he can't truly believe a word of it himself? Surely, no-one's THAT delusional...are they?

I think some are that ignorant, greedy and uncaring, none of which excuses him in the slightest

[Hussulo 6]

There are within a mintage two type of coins. Normally, the presses mint the coins for circulation. However, within the quantities minted, there are certain items (analysis) which are extremely brilliant uncirculated, on both sides, with are put a side and designed as Proofs, and values will be increased with an eye on profit and interested collectors. Long type ago, the mints were using the word Proof inserted on the coin. However, when sets were solely minted for that effect, due to its limitation (not higher on Proof results) but short on general presentation, they were melted down. Now, regarding the bronzed coin listed above, shall I correct your quote "…no berries…" and clarify that the coin has 10 berries on 'Britannia". Also, there are only a single bronzed Proof coins on 1806. Further more, also unique, the "soho" incuse and a small ship. Nearly identical design on the Farthing. Last, but not least, Penny, 1/2 Penny and Farthing were part of the Fourth Issue uniquely minted by Soho Mint (Birmingham), all coins were minted as die axis. Regards.

- yestodtom

My head hurts

[Rob 3,152]

Actually, there was a bit more which ran over onto page two of my archived document.

As you clearly don't have a clue how to identify a proof coin and don't seem to be able to take on board advice when given, I despair. It is also obvious that you struggle with some of the more elementary aspects of numismatics such as grading - your Jersey 1/26th shilling described as aUN when in reality it is fair, and your 1896 crown described in similar grade are appalling examples of grading. Everything is UNC if you ignore the wear - which you freely do. I feel obliged to report this as an incorrectly described item given your reluctance to take on board the misleading description. I'm sorry, but I might as well be talking to a Dundee cake.

I've reported it, but fat chance there is of anything happening. Remarkably, this person doesn't need to be registered for VAT. Sell one or two coins at those prices and there wouldn't be any option re-VAT. On the plus side, that shows that your average collector is a bit wiser than this seller.

[Paulus 1,975]

Actually, there was a bit more which ran over onto page two of my archived document.

As you clearly don't have a clue how to identify a proof coin and don't seem to be able to take on board advice when given, I despair. It is also obvious that you struggle with some of the more elementary aspects of numismatics such as grading - your Jersey 1/26th shilling described as aUN when in reality it is fair, and your 1896 crown described in similar grade are appalling examples of grading. Everything is UNC if you ignore the wear - which you freely do. I feel obliged to report this as an incorrectly described item given your reluctance to take on board the misleading description. I'm sorry, but I might as well be talking to a Dundee cake.

I've reported it, but fat chance there is of anything happening. Remarkably, this person doesn't need to be registered for VAT. Sell one or two coins at those prices and there wouldn't be any option re-VAT. On the plus side, that shows that your average collector is a bit wiser than this seller.

You crack me up Rob, I have never had the balls to send such a forthright message to an eBay seller (well perhaps I should!)

My last 'outraged' message was about an apparently UNC coin, the coin was GF at best and I asked him if he was sure about the UNC grade quoted, and did he know what UNC meant. His response was 'Yes, and you are so rude' ... he was an American though!

[Rob 3,152]

The problem is that almost everything is described as EF - UNC with BIN prices to match. If the items were BIN or best offer then you could put in a reasonable bid, but with only a BIN you don't want to buy something whether the seller offers returns or not. Nobody is going to pay £315 for a VF 1806 no berries halfpenny. Even moving the decimal point one place is too much to pay, but getting rid of the 3 is a possibility.

[Paulus 1,975]

The problem is that almost everything is described as EF - UNC with BIN prices to match. If the items were BIN or best offer then you could put in a reasonable bid, but with only a BIN you don't want to buy something whether the seller offers returns or not. Nobody is going to pay £315 for a VF 1806 no berries halfpenny. Even moving the decimal point one place is too much to pay, but getting rid of the 3 is a possibility.

I have done quite well both buying and selling with 'BIN or best offer' recently, I agree 'BIN only' meets with little success, especially if over-graded and/or overpriced (obviously)

There is a no quibble return policy with BIN items on the Bay which obviously helps the buyer somewhat

[Rob 3,152]

I have done quite well both buying and selling with 'BIN or best offer' recently, I agree 'BIN only' meets with little success, especially if over-graded and/or overpriced (obviously)

There is a no quibble return policy with BIN items on the Bay which obviously helps the buyer somewhat

The problem is that any seller who wants a reasonable return has to overprice in order to recoup the ebay charges. When you are losing 15-20% in fees, it has to be recovered by charging more. If sellers still had the option to bypass Paypal, it would be possible to reduce the charges and so lower prices to the buyer.

[argentumandcoins 70]

£93 for this

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rare-1823-A-D-King-George-IIII-Gold-Sovereign-Type-Coin-Contemporary-Forgery-/140975633320?pt=UK_Coins_BritishMilled_RL&hash=item20d2cd73a8&autorefresh=true

Neither an accurate nor an honest description. Still some mugs who see the word "gold" and trip over their brain cell in a rush to reach their wallet though (yes, I know I used cell in the singular)

[Rob 3,152]

£93 for this

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rare-1823-A-D-King-George-IIII-Gold-Sovereign-Type-Coin-Contemporary-Forgery-/140975633320?pt=UK_Coins_BritishMilled_RL&hash=item20d2cd73a8&autorefresh=true

Neither an accurate nor an honest description. Still some mugs who see the word "gold" and trip over their brain cell in a rush to reach their wallet though (yes, I know I used cell in the singular)

Saxby's always been easy to spot from afar and thus easy to avoid. The on screen portrayal may have changed over the years, but the undesirability of what's on offer hasn't.

[Paulus 1,975]

I have done quite well both buying and selling with 'BIN or best offer' recently, I agree 'BIN only' meets with little success, especially if over-graded and/or overpriced (obviously)

There is a no quibble return policy with BIN items on the Bay which obviously helps the buyer somewhat

The problem is that any seller who wants a reasonable return has to overprice in order to recoup the ebay charges. When you are losing 15-20% in fees, it has to be recovered by charging more. If sellers still had the option to bypass Paypal, it would be possible to reduce the charges and so lower prices to the buyer.

Many of my sales and purchases on eBay have ended up outside of eBay and Paypal, even with my first transaction with a buyer or seller Once a negotiation starts, it becomes immediately obvious that it would be mutually beneficial to cut eBay and PayPal out of the equation (once you have established some trust!). EBay hate it of course, but there are ways and means that are not complicated, and the best thing is it builds you an invaluable network of trusted contacts for repeat business!

So I think you may want to experiment with the Bay Rob, see what you think!

[Rob 3,152]

I have done quite well both buying and selling with 'BIN or best offer' recently, I agree 'BIN only' meets with little success, especially if over-graded and/or overpriced (obviously)

There is a no quibble return policy with BIN items on the Bay which obviously helps the buyer somewhat

The problem is that any seller who wants a reasonable return has to overprice in order to recoup the ebay charges. When you are losing 15-20% in fees, it has to be recovered by charging more. If sellers still had the option to bypass Paypal, it would be possible to reduce the charges and so lower prices to the buyer.

Many of my sales and purchases on eBay have ended up outside of eBay and Paypal, even with my first transaction with a buyer or seller Once a negotiation starts, it becomes immediately obvious that it would be mutually beneficial to cut eBay and PayPal out of the equation (once you have established some trust!). EBay hate it of course, but there are ways and means that are not complicated, and the best thing is it builds you an invaluable network of trusted contacts for repeat business!

So I think you may want to experiment with the Bay Rob, see what you think!

I used to. I stopped when they made accepting Paypal obligatory. Having previously had a fallout with them which ended up at the ombudsman and me a few hundred pounds richer, it was a decision that I was never going to rescind. eBay's policy of buyer good, seller bad is hardly welcoming, and to ensure you get a fair return, you need to start above £1 which means people ignore the listing. On balance, the hassle of listing for a week or ten days, but not selling because you aren't offering the item on a 99% discount is unattractive.

[Paulus 1,975]

I have done quite well both buying and selling with 'BIN or best offer' recently, I agree 'BIN only' meets with little success, especially if over-graded and/or overpriced (obviously)

There is a no quibble return policy with BIN items on the Bay which obviously helps the buyer somewhat

The problem is that any seller who wants a reasonable return has to overprice in order to recoup the ebay charges. When you are losing 15-20% in fees, it has to be recovered by charging more. If sellers still had the option to bypass Paypal, it would be possible to reduce the charges and so lower prices to the buyer.

Many of my sales and purchases on eBay have ended up outside of eBay and Paypal, even with my first transaction with a buyer or seller Once a negotiation starts, it becomes immediately obvious that it would be mutually beneficial to cut eBay and PayPal out of the equation (once you have established some trust!). EBay hate it of course, but there are ways and means that are not complicated, and the best thing is it builds you an invaluable network of trusted contacts for repeat business!

So I think you may want to experiment with the Bay Rob, see what you think!

I used to. I stopped when they made accepting Paypal obligatory. Having previously had a fallout with them which ended up at the ombudsman and me a few hundred pounds richer, it was a decision that I was never going to rescind. eBay's policy of buyer good, seller bad is hardly welcoming, and to ensure you get a fair return, you need to start above £1 which means people ignore the listing. On balance, the hassle of listing for a week or ten days, but not selling because you aren't offering the item on a 99% discount is unattractive.

I also find the whole experience very 'seller beware' and slanted towards the buyer. What I am saying has worked well for me is the 'BIN or best offer' listings that quickly migrate to a negotiation and deal outside of eBay and Paypal, and future deals with satisfied/delighted buyers. This can happen on the first deal, and is very common I think! Obviously the buyer and seller don't get the fantastic insurance offered by a regular eBay purchase, but when dealing with proper collectors this has yet to prove to be a problem for me ... might be worth a go for a handful of your hard-to-shift coins?