Fur or no fur?

[Emperor Oli 0]

I agree with the killing of animals for their skins. I think it's just like the slaughter of cows, sheep and poultry etc. for their meat.

Another question - Do you own any fur items?

I have a fur hat, the type used by soldiers in the russian army made of rabbit fur.

[Master Jmd 80]

No, i disagree, for food purposes is ok, because we cant make cirtain foods without meat, but we can make clothes, and artificial fur, without real furs.

[Half Penny Jon 0]

I agree with JMD, there are alternatives to fur in the manufacture of textiles.

PS: It's CERTAIN not CIRTAIN Master JMD.

[Master Jmd 80]

How is this shocking? Many people buy and wear fur. It's just the same as saying "Do you agree with meat eating?" This wouldn't shock people, as the majority do it.

well, i have only seen about 2 real-fur clothing items on people, all i mostly see is artificial fur, like the clip-on artificial fur on some coat-hoods

[Half Penny Jon 0]

Frankly, I couldn't care less if you think this is spam because it fits none of the criteria.

And if the population of elephants or tigers can be maintained, and only if they can be maintained, then I see no reason not to harvest them.

How is this shocking? Many people buy and wear fur. It's just the same as saying "Do you agree with meat eating?" This wouldn't shock people, as the majority do it.

I am very surprised that you think the "harvesting" of animals as you put it is at all acceptable Oli. It surprises me that you support such a cruel and pointless market.

[Sylvester 15]

I may not be an animal lover, but i do have alot of respect for animals of all shapes and sizes, the amount of spiders i've saved from certain death at the hands of someone is amazing.

I certainly have alot more respect for animals than i do for my fellow man, i hear stories of kids shooting squirrels or tying fireworks to cats for a joke. Very sick people...

I don't like waste, and i don't like the idea of animals suffering for a pointless cause. And that's my two guineas.

[Half Penny Jon 0]

All I want to say in this thread is that I cannot understand for the life of me why some idiot would ponse around killing a vital and harmless part of our world. What really sickens me is they they do it in the name if fashon! Finally, I just want to say that Oli needs to have a re-think on his animal policy.

[Sylvester 15]

Well i wouldn't exactly call a tiger or a lion harmless but i agree with you HPJ!

[Emperor Oli 0]

Everyone to their own HPJ! If you don't like the idea of animals being killed, then I'm fine with that. I've been brought up going to hunts and shoots and with people wearing some fur items as the norm so it is quite hard for me to see the other viewpoint, although I can do it in a somewhat impaired fashion.

Btw, you called them harmless. I wouldn't call mink or foxes harmless - they are vicious vermin.

[Sylvester 15]

I kinda like foxes.

If there is one animal i really can't stand, it's dogs. I wouldn't go as far as shooting them or harming them, but i would be stood on top of the nearest table until someone had removed the beast.

Dogs... *shudder*

Cats are nice though, i like cats. Squirrels are my fave animal though, i love squirrels. Especially red ones.

[Sylvester 15]

Isn't there a nicer way to solve the fox problem without having them ripped apart by a bunch of savage rancid canine fiends?

Can't they be shot or something?

[Emperor Oli 0]

No way foxes are Public Enemy No.1! A friend of mine is a farmer and a whole field of his sheep was wiped out overnight by a ravenous fox. Not very nice at all.

I'm not a big dog person but I really depise those ratty excuses-for-dogs. You know the really small ones old ladies carry around in their handbags?

[Sylvester 15]

No way foxes are Public Enemy No.1! A friend of mine is a farmer and a whole field of his sheep was wiped out overnight by a ravenous fox. Not very nice at all.

I'm not a big dog person but I really depise those ratty excuses-for-dogs. You know the really small ones old ladies carry around in their handbags?

I never did like farmers...

But i realise that foxes are a major issue from their point of view. I know cos i live in a farming community (what's left of it), and we get the odd fox, hence why i have to lock the pet goose away at night.

I think pigeons might hold the record for Enemy number 1 though!

[Emperor Oli 0]

Ahh hunting, this is where I come in useful!

Hunting is the most effective way to kill foxes, there is no doubt about it.

The alternatives:

Poisoning prolongs the death of the fox and makes it weak and susceptible to attack.

Snaring is ghastly and even I am against this.

Shooting is probably on a par with hunting, but not shooting with a shotgun - only a rifle will do. Plus shooting has to be carried out in daytime, otherwise the bullet may only cause a flesh wound and/or do serious damage, but not kill it outright.

The main problem with hunting is that the fox is not always killed instantly. Nine times out of ten, the dogs will break the fox's neck, causing immediate death but sometimes, this does not happen. In this case, the fox's organs are ruptured etc and it is a very bloody end indeed. The hounds are trained to go for the neck and this is what usually happens; it is only the younger dogs who do not break it.

If you want further reading, the Burns report is an excellent flick. It's about 200 pages and can be tedious but it gives up-to-date (2000) stats on all kinds of hunting in the UK with the effects of a ban.

[Master Jmd 80]

Dogs... *shudder*

Cats are nice though, i like cats. Squirrels are my fave animal though, i love squirrels. Especially red ones.

i love dogs i was bought up with a mastif that was 2 years older then me, sadly died in 1999

i like cats, but i have athsma, and cats seem to start my athsma off

i love squirels too; every morning when i first come downstairs there is a squirel on the bird table ...i have only ever seen a red squirel once; that was at Kilkenny castle (southern ireland)

i hate spiders

[Sylvester 15]

Oh i love spiders... gorgoeus creatures, i just think it is well cool the way they walk and the way they spin their webs...

[Master Jmd 80]

Oh i love spiders... gorgoeus creatures, i just think it is well cool the way they walk and the way they spin their webs...

yes, i like that fact, but its whats known as aracnaphobia i believe; the fright of spiders sad really

what are you scared of sylvester?

[Sylvester 15]

For some bizarre reason 5 things really make me feel nervous or uncomfortable. One scares the hell out of me.

5) Dogs (they make me feel uncomfortable, but i can usually control my urge to run away)

4) Bees and Wasps (obvious really)

3) A very slight fear of Heights (also flying probably as it involves heights)

2) Agoraphobia (Which is a fear of Markets and open spaces... it may sound odd but the fear is because you are in a position where you are trapped in by people or in a place where you cannot escape or hide should you have to for any strange reason, like if there was a fire).

I do go in markets but i walk around them at 10 miles an hour and i get very nervous when i get surrounded by lots of people, i just want to get away as fast as possible, to the point where i get footpath rage and barge straight through people if they annoy me too much by stopping in front of you when there's a whole load of people all away around me... arrrghhhh! Get me out. Small spaces don't bother me though as long as i know there is a way out. Lifts bother me.

1) Slugs, oh god they really put the fear of god in me, i hate em i hate em, dunno why but i've had nightmares about the damn things... I can't go near one without feeling nausiated. *shudder* Despite all this i really don't like it when people salt them... it must be agony for the poor things, melting like that.

[Sylvester 15]

I'm not too keen on things that fly either, whether it be a bird or a ball that comes whistling towards you off of the end of a cricket bat...

I never was keen on pigeons flying over my head, the flapping wings bother me, but not half as much as the fact that it's aiming for me.

[Master Jmd 80]

phobias are strange

i also have a phobia to:

heights - i can control my fear, but when it comes to looking off of the edge of something or climing ladders i sometimes cant move

and:

closed spaces - i hate being trapped or in a small room on my own

[Half Penny Jon 0]

Everyone to their own HPJ! If you don't like the idea of animals being killed, then I'm fine with that. I've been brought up going to hunts and shoots and with people wearing some fur items as the norm so it is quite hard for me to see the other viewpoint, although I can do it in a somewhat impaired fashion.

Btw, you called them harmless. I wouldn't call mink or foxes harmless - they are vicious vermin.

I have been brought up in a similar way too. My father encouraged me to go to hunts but I just couldn't see the point. I have only been a few times.

[Geoff T 3]

Isn't there a nicer way to solve the fox problem without having them ripped apart by a bunch of savage rancid canine fiends?

Can't they be shot or something?

The pro-hunting brigade always takes refuge in the idea that foxes are vermin which must be eliminated, but true elimination would spoil their fun. What they really mean is that they want to kill a few off but leave plenty more left over for the next time they're in the mood for ripping animals apart for the hell of it.

Who was it who said that pro-hunters always come up with upteen reasons why they do it but no real arguments? I've even known supporters who objectively can see that that's a valid comment.

[Geoff T 3]

I'm not too keen on things that fly either, whether it be a bird or a ball that comes whistling towards you off of the end of a cricket bat...

I never was keen on pigeons flying over my head, the flapping wings bother me, but not half as much as the fact that it's aiming for me.

As a child I would go absolutely hysterical if I saw a dead bird. I still don't like the things and on the few occasions I've had to deal with one that's been the victim of a cat I've done so with the utmost reluctance. Pigeons are by far the worst; I can't feel comfortable even when the things are alive.

Ironically, I eat tons of dead birds but they come to me as free range poultry or game. So long as someone else has done all the business of making them not look like a dead bird I have no problems at all. My pheasant ragout is to die for.

[Chris Perkins 228]

I'm actually allergic to Turkey (the bird, not the country) and the last time I ate it I went into anaphilactic shock and had to have an ambulance. And that was on Christmas day!

I also have a less accute problem with Chicken, which is a shame because I actully like the taste of Turkey and Chicken very much.

[Master Jmd 80]

I'm actually allergic to Turkey (the bird, not the country) and the last time I ate it I went into anaphilactic shock and had to have an ambulance. And that was on Christmas day!

I also have a less accute problem with Chicken, which is a shame because I actully like the taste of Turkey and Chicken very much.

im alergic to eggs and tuna; even though they are totaly different (an unhached bird and a dead fish), i get she same alergic reaction; i loose my voice for about 1 - 2 hours

Edited June 2, 2004 by Master Jmd