Isle of Man Onchan Internment Camp 1d

[sweetcheeks82 0]

I have two Isle of Man Onchan Internment Camp 1d coins, can anyone tell me their value please?

thanks

[davidrj 194]

I have two Isle of Man Onchan Internment Camp 1d coins, can anyone tell me their value please?

thanks

Krause World Coins list the penny at $6 in F, $15 in VF, $35 in EF and $80 in UNC if they are genuine

Not my area of expertise, but they are quite scarce, just 20,000 minted

The 1/2d and the 6d are even rarer apparently, just 2,000 and 2,500 minted respectively

Yours look to be at least EF grade, but a note of caution they could be modern copies, do you have any provenance?

Hope this helps

David

Edited April 7, 2011 by davidrj

[SionGilbey 1]

http://www.predecimal.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=2733

[sweetcheeks82 0]

I have two Isle of Man Onchan Internment Camp 1d coins, can anyone tell me their value please?

thanks

Krause World Coins list the penny at $6 in F, $15 in VF, $35 in EF and $80 in UNC if they are genuine

Not my area of expertise, but they are quite scarce, just 20,000 minted

The 1/2d and the 6d are even rarer apparently, just 2,000 and 2,500 minted respectively

Yours look to be at least EF grade, but a note of caution they could be modern copies, do you have any provenance?

Hope this helps

David

Hi what does provenance mean? I live in the Isle of Man, they were my dads. The Photos dont display the true colour, i took them in bad lighting, they are alot darker than shown. Thanks for your reply.

[sweetcheeks82 0]

http://www.predecimal.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=2733

Thanks for the link, that was very helpful.

[1949threepence 3,367]

http://www.predecimal.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=2733

Thanks for the link, that was very helpful.

It was, and thanks for showing us your pics, sweetcheeks. I wasn't aware such coins existed.

Wonder why they didn't just use normal coinage in the camps.

[1949threepence 3,367]

I have two Isle of Man Onchan Internment Camp 1d coins, can anyone tell me their value please?

thanks

Krause World Coins list the penny at $6 in F, $15 in VF, $35 in EF and $80 in UNC if they are genuine

Not my area of expertise, but they are quite scarce, just 20,000 minted

The 1/2d and the 6d are even rarer apparently, just 2,000 and 2,500 minted respectively

Yours look to be at least EF grade, but a note of caution they could be modern copies, do you have any provenance?

Hope this helps

David

Hi what does provenance mean? I live in the Isle of Man, they were my dads. The Photos dont display the true colour, i took them in bad lighting, they are alot darker than shown. Thanks for your reply.

It means some sort of verifiable certification which proves that the coins (or whatever object, as the term is often applied to antiques), are the genuine article from the period to which they are attributed.

[Rob 3,152]

I have two Isle of Man Onchan Internment Camp 1d coins, can anyone tell me their value please?

thanks

Krause World Coins list the penny at $6 in F, $15 in VF, $35 in EF and $80 in UNC if they are genuine

Not my area of expertise, but they are quite scarce, just 20,000 minted

The 1/2d and the 6d are even rarer apparently, just 2,000 and 2,500 minted respectively

Yours look to be at least EF grade, but a note of caution they could be modern copies, do you have any provenance?

Hope this helps

David

Hi what does provenance mean? I live in the Isle of Man, they were my dads. The Photos dont display the true colour, i took them in bad lighting, they are alot darker than shown. Thanks for your reply.

It means some sort of verifiable certification which proves that the coins (or whatever object, as the term is often applied to antiques), are the genuine article from the period to which they are attributed.

A provenance is a traceable history of ownership. For example, if an article previously and demonstrably owned by a famous celebrity came up for sale, it is likely to realise more at auction based on that fact of ownership than an identical item previously owned by Mr Anonymous of Bognor Regis. Similarly for coins, examples that have been in the most famous and usually in quality terms the best collections tend to also realise better prices. But in simple terms, a provenance is a record of past ownership by whoever.

[Rob 3,152]

Wonder why they didn't just use normal coinage in the camps.

Many POWs had a desire to get out of their prison camp, so any legal currency would be retained for use on an escape. Having tokens circulating in the camp meant they had a currency which was useless outside.

[scott 144]

i have some austrian WW1 pow camp coins i found in the tokens tin at my dealers.

where in krause are these listed exactly?

never seen the isle of man ones, but there were also tokens for use in military bases so plenty of nice little pieces to find

[argentumandcoins 70]

I have two Isle of Man Onchan Internment Camp 1d coins, can anyone tell me their value please?

thanks

Krause World Coins list the penny at $6 in F, $15 in VF, $35 in EF and $80 in UNC if they are genuine

Not my area of expertise, but they are quite scarce, just 20,000 minted

The 1/2d and the 6d are even rarer apparently, just 2,000 and 2,500 minted respectively

Yours look to be at least EF grade, but a note of caution they could be modern copies, do you have any provenance?

Hope this helps

David

Hi what does provenance mean? I live in the Isle of Man, they were my dads. The Photos dont display the true colour, i took them in bad lighting, they are alot darker than shown. Thanks for your reply.

If the Onchan tokens are real and not some sort of post war souvenir they are very saleable.

IOM copper coinage (1709-1813 in particular) is very sought after, particularly in the US and this extends to the wartime tokens.

[sweetcheeks82 0]

I have two Isle of Man Onchan Internment Camp 1d coins, can anyone tell me their value please?

thanks

Krause World Coins list the penny at $6 in F, $15 in VF, $35 in EF and $80 in UNC if they are genuine

Not my area of expertise, but they are quite scarce, just 20,000 minted

The 1/2d and the 6d are even rarer apparently, just 2,000 and 2,500 minted respectively

Yours look to be at least EF grade, but a note of caution they could be modern copies, do you have any provenance?

Hope this helps

David

Hi what does provenance mean? I live in the Isle of Man, they were my dads. The Photos dont display the true colour, i took them in bad lighting, they are alot darker than shown. Thanks for your reply.

If the Onchan tokens are real and not some sort of post war souvenir they are very saleable.

IOM copper coinage (1709-1813 in particular) is very sought after, particularly in the US and this extends to the wartime tokens.

Wow your all so knowledgeable. do you think this has any value, its abit worn though.

[Rob 3,152]

Wow your all so knowledgeable. do you think this has any value, its abit worn though.

This is a privately issued halfpenny token. It was made by Halliday and the issuer is reported to be William Callister of Ramsey - vide Clay. Davis type 25, see note at the foot of p.247 regarding the attribution. Given it isn't indicated as being rare, yours being quite worn would not imply any significant value. As common mint state pieces frequently go for say £40-50, a pound or two is all I would expect unless there is special interest involved.

[1949threepence 3,367]

Wonder why they didn't just use normal coinage in the camps.

Many POWs had a desire to get out of their prison camp, so any legal currency would be retained for use on an escape. Having tokens circulating in the camp meant they had a currency which was useless outside.

Yes, of course. That makes very obvious sense.

[Red Riley 2]

Wonder why they didn't just use normal coinage in the camps.

Many POWs had a desire to get out of their prison camp, so any legal currency would be retained for use on an escape. Having tokens circulating in the camp meant they had a currency which was useless outside.

Think I'm right in saying that they weren't technically POWs but non-combatant Germans stranded in this country on the outbreak of war, many of whom were were vehemently opposed to the Nazi regime. In most cases the chances of them wanting to escape and head back to Germany was nil to negligable. In fact many of the internees campaigned to be allowed to fight for us! After the war many of them stayed on here.

[davidrj 194]

Think I'm right in saying that they weren't technically POWs but non-combatant Germans stranded in this country on the outbreak of war, many of whom were were vehemently opposed to the Nazi regime. In most cases the chances of them wanting to escape and head back to Germany was nil to negligable. In fact many of the internees campaigned to be allowed to fight for us! After the war many of them stayed on here.

From Wikipedia

Isle of Man

During World War I the British government interned male citizens of the Central Powers, principally Germany, Austria-Hungary and Ottoman Turkey.^[83] They were held mainly in internment camps at Knockaloe, close to Peel, and a smaller one near Douglas.

During World War II, about 8,000 people were interned in Britain, many being held in the same camps at Knockaloe and Douglas on the Isle of Man. The internees included enemy aliens from the Axis Powers, principally Germany and Italy.^[84]

Initially, refugees who had fled from Germany were also included, as were suspected British Nazi sympathisers such as British Union of Fascists leader Oswald Mosley. The British government rounded up 74,000 German, Austrian and Italian aliens. Within 6 months the 112 alien tribunals had individually summoned and examined 64,000 aliens, and the vast majority were released, having been found to be "friendly aliens" (mostly Jews); examples include Hermann Bondi and Thomas Gold and later members of the Amadeus Quartet. British nationals were detained under Defence Regulation 18B. Eventually only 2,000 of the remainder were interned. Initially they were shipped overseas, but that was halted when a German U boat sank the SS Arandora Star in July 1940 with the loss of 800 internees, though this was not the first loss that had occurred. The last internees were released late in 1945, though many were released in 1942. In Britain, internees were housed in camps and prisons. Some camps had tents rather than buildings with internees sleeping directly on the ground. Men and women were separated and most contact with the outside world was denied. A number of prominent Britons including writer H. G. Wells campaigned against the internment of refugees.

See also: Defence Regulation 18B

[1949threepence 3,367]

Think I'm right in saying that they weren't technically POWs but non-combatant Germans stranded in this country on the outbreak of war, many of whom were were vehemently opposed to the Nazi regime. In most cases the chances of them wanting to escape and head back to Germany was nil to negligable. In fact many of the internees campaigned to be allowed to fight for us! After the war many of them stayed on here.

From Wikipedia

Isle of Man

During World War I the British government interned male citizens of the Central Powers, principally Germany, Austria-Hungary and Ottoman Turkey.^[83] They were held mainly in internment camps at Knockaloe, close to Peel, and a smaller one near Douglas.

During World War II, about 8,000 people were interned in Britain, many being held in the same camps at Knockaloe and Douglas on the Isle of Man. The internees included enemy aliens from the Axis Powers, principally Germany and Italy.^[84]

Initially, refugees who had fled from Germany were also included, as were suspected British Nazi sympathisers such as British Union of Fascists leader Oswald Mosley. The British government rounded up 74,000 German, Austrian and Italian aliens. Within 6 months the 112 alien tribunals had individually summoned and examined 64,000 aliens, and the vast majority were released, having been found to be "friendly aliens" (mostly Jews); examples include Hermann Bondi and Thomas Gold and later members of the Amadeus Quartet. British nationals were detained under Defence Regulation 18B. Eventually only 2,000 of the remainder were interned. Initially they were shipped overseas, but that was halted when a German U boat sank the SS Arandora Star in July 1940 with the loss of 800 internees, though this was not the first loss that had occurred. The last internees were released late in 1945, though many were released in 1942. In Britain, internees were housed in camps and prisons. Some camps had tents rather than buildings with internees sleeping directly on the ground. Men and women were separated and most contact with the outside world was denied. A number of prominent Britons including writer H. G. Wells campaigned against the internment of refugees.

See also: Defence Regulation 18B

The government couldn't afford to take the slightest chance in view of what this country was up against at the time. We were fighting alone until 1941 when both the Soviet Union and then USA joined the war.

However convincing they were, "Friendly aliens" could have been spies or enemy saboteurs. They had to be sure before releasing them.

[sweetcheeks82 0]

thats really interesting, thanks guys.