Scarce varieties of common coins

[declanwmagee 122]

In my continuing quest for the scarcer varieties of common coins, can anyone tell me if it's really worth looking for:

1965 6d D.2503 Groom 3+D

1964 6d D.2502 Groom 4+C

1956 ½d F.473 Groom 3+D

1937 3dAg D.2231 1+B

These are the ones that I've never seen anywhere!

cheers

Declan

[Peckris 579]

In my continuing quest for the scarcer varieties of common coins, can anyone tell me if it's really worth looking for:

1965 6d D.2503 Groom 3+D

1964 6d D.2502 Groom 4+C

1956 ½d F.473 Groom 3+D

1937 3dAg D.2231 1+B

These are the ones that I've never seen anywhere!

cheers

Declan

One of those sixpence varieties is scarce, but I can never remember which one (consults 1970 listing ...) - yes, the 1965 with the earlier obverse / milling (rated RARE).

Any 1956 halfpenny that is not the normal regular type is also RARE.

[declanwmagee 122]

Thanks for the reply, Mr. Peckris - I'll keep looking. Davies says the 1937 silver 3d is unconfirmed but I've got an eBay search set up so I can check each one that gets put on. Think its worth my time?

[davidrj 194]

In my continuing quest for the scarcer varieties of common coins, can anyone tell me if it's really worth looking for:

1965 6d D.2503 Groom 3+D

1964 6d D.2502 Groom 4+C

1956 ½d F.473 Groom 3+D

1937 3dAg D.2231 1+B

These are the ones that I've never seen anywhere!

cheers

Declan

Can I add the 1967 pennies with

1) Stalk in helmet

2) Tidal wave next to lighthouse

Never seen a photo of either

David

Edited April 7, 2011 by davidrj

[DaveG38 410]

In my continuing quest for the scarcer varieties of common coins, can anyone tell me if it's really worth looking for:

1965 6d D.2503 Groom 3+D

1964 6d D.2502 Groom 4+C

1956 ½d F.473 Groom 3+D

1937 3dAg D.2231 1+B

These are the ones that I've never seen anywhere!

cheers

Declan

Declan,

In my experience, these dates and denominations are so common, that you are unlikely to see their varieties identified and advertised by the average dealer. The more knowledgeable may do so, but for most there is probably little incentive to go through their stocks to see if a rare variety is lurking. As far as eBay goes, again I doubt that many sellers are aware of the varieties, so there is always the possibility that one will pop up - having said this, it seems likely if they do that forum members will pick them up quickly.

So from my point of view, the best options are either rooting about in boot/antique fair pots of run of the mill coins, or boxes of similar material in general auctions. If you are lucky this will reward you with specimens albeit probably not in top condition.

[azda 979]

In my continuing quest for the scarcer varieties of common coins, can anyone tell me if it's really worth looking for:

1965 6d D.2503 Groom 3+D

1964 6d D.2502 Groom 4+C

1956 ½d F.473 Groom 3+D

1937 3dAg D.2231 1+B

These are the ones that I've never seen anywhere!

cheers

Declan

Declan,

In my experience, these dates and denominations are so common, that you are unlikely to see their varieties identified and advertised by the average dealer. The more knowledgeable may do so, but for most there is probably little incentive to go through their stocks to see if a rare variety is lurking. As far as eBay goes, again I doubt that many sellers are aware of the varieties, so there is always the possibility that one will pop up - having said this, it seems likely if they do that forum members will pick them up quickly.

So from my point of view, the best options are either rooting about in boot/antique fair pots of run of the mill coins, or boxes of similar material in general auctions. If you are lucky this will reward you with specimens albeit probably not in top condition.

My brain isn't as long as an elephants trunk, i find it impossible to remember every variety on earth, i would assume others are in the same boat and will always miss something, so unless it's brought to your attention in recent times and you remember it and it's for sale, chances are you will remember, but if it's not been around in say 5 years from now, or never mentioned again, chances are you'll pass right by it

[declanwmagee 122]

In my continuing quest for the scarcer varieties of common coins, can anyone tell me if it's really worth looking for:

1965 6d D.2503 Groom 3+D

1964 6d D.2502 Groom 4+C

1956 ½d F.473 Groom 3+D

1937 3dAg D.2231 1+B

These are the ones that I've never seen anywhere!

cheers

Declan

Declan,

In my experience, these dates and denominations are so common, that you are unlikely to see their varieties identified and advertised by the average dealer. The more knowledgeable may do so, but for most there is probably little incentive to go through their stocks to see if a rare variety is lurking. As far as eBay goes, again I doubt that many sellers are aware of the varieties, so there is always the possibility that one will pop up - having said this, it seems likely if they do that forum members will pick them up quickly.

So from my point of view, the best options are either rooting about in boot/antique fair pots of run of the mill coins, or boxes of similar material in general auctions. If you are lucky this will reward you with specimens albeit probably not in top condition.

No you're quite right. In fact, looking for the varieties has brought the treasure hunt back to the hobby. I found a D.2331 1962 2/6 the other day unidentified from a well-known dealer.

My question really was not "has anyone ever seen these advertised?", but "has anyone ever seen these?".

I've only been seriously looking for a few months, but I must have checked hundreds of 1964/1965 sixpences, and 1937 silver threepences!

[Gary D 76]

In my continuing quest for the scarcer varieties of common coins, can anyone tell me if it's really worth looking for:

1965 6d D.2503 Groom 3+D

1964 6d D.2502 Groom 4+C

1956 ½d F.473 Groom 3+D

1937 3dAg D.2231 1+B

These are the ones that I've never seen anywhere!

cheers

Declan

Declan,

In my experience, these dates and denominations are so common, that you are unlikely to see their varieties identified and advertised by the average dealer. The more knowledgeable may do so, but for most there is probably little incentive to go through their stocks to see if a rare variety is lurking. As far as eBay goes, again I doubt that many sellers are aware of the varieties, so there is always the possibility that one will pop up - having said this, it seems likely if they do that forum members will pick them up quickly.

So from my point of view, the best options are either rooting about in boot/antique fair pots of run of the mill coins, or boxes of similar material in general auctions. If you are lucky this will reward you with specimens albeit probably not in top condition.

No you're quite right. In fact, looking for the varieties has brought the treasure hunt back to the hobby. I found a D.2331 1962 2/6 the other day unidentified from a well-known dealer.

My question really was not "has anyone ever seen these advertised?", but "has anyone ever seen these?".

I've only been seriously looking for a few months, but I must have checked hundreds of 1964/1965 sixpences, and 1937 silver threepences!

I've been looking for the 3d for several years now and have never seen one. The 1956 1/2d pop up, I've had spares but very little interest on ebay for them. The 1964 6d is not that scarce. The 1965 I had to buy Davies example to get one, never seen one anywhere else.

Gary

[Peckris 579]

In my continuing quest for the scarcer varieties of common coins, can anyone tell me if it's really worth looking for:

1965 6d D.2503 Groom 3+D

1964 6d D.2502 Groom 4+C

1956 ½d F.473 Groom 3+D

1937 3dAg D.2231 1+B

These are the ones that I've never seen anywhere!

cheers

Declan

Can I add the 1967 pennies with

1) Stalk in helmet

2) Tidal wave next to lighthouse

Never seen a photo of either

David

The "tidal wave" penny is 1966 - I bought one for a tenner from Phoenix Fairs some years back.

I've been looking for the 3d for several years now and have never seen one. The 1956 1/2d pop up, I've had spares but very little interest on ebay for them. The 1964 6d is not that scarce. The 1965 I had to buy Davies example to get one, never seen one anywhere else.

Gary

Do you still have a 1956 1/2d spare Gary? I only really want one of them, which is the one with the wider rim, I of DEI to a space. PM me if you have one.

[scott 144]

how scarce is the 1968 halfpenny?

[declanwmagee 122]

how scarce is the 1968 halfpenny?

Not that scarce I don't think - it's another one most people don't notice, so you could probably find one for peanuts being sold as a 1967. I knock 'em out for £8 each but for gods sake don't pay that!

[scott 144]

i have only ever seen 1.. which i got for like 5p or something

never heard of the 3D variety

[Peckris 579]

how scarce is the 1968 halfpenny?

Not that scarce I don't think - it's another one most people don't notice, so you could probably find one for peanuts being sold as a 1967. I knock 'em out for £8 each but for gods sake don't pay that!

£8 is an extraordinary price! I knocked 'em out at 50p from my list in the late 1990s, and the regular one for 20p. That probably gives an idea of the comparative scarcity - it's really not rare at all, and probably accounts for at least one fifth, maybe up to a third?, of all 1967 halfpennies. By the same token, maybe more got melted down as people had probably put aside large stockpiles of 1967s already; mind you, collectors were made aware of the variety long before the halfpenny was finally demonetised.

[declanwmagee 122]

I know. I do worry sometimes whether my place in heaven is in any jeopardy by getting into this buying and selling lark.

I'm such a terrible negotiator in real life but when it comes to coins I'm Mr Hard Nosed.

[declanwmagee 122]

Well, luckily, I still have scans of most of the coins that have passed through my hands over the last 5 years, so here's a straw poll of some of these. It's not quite V.R. Court in terms of sample size, but you get the idea...

1967 ½d Normal rim: 21

1967 ½d Wide rim: 7

1965 6d D.2503: 0

1965 6d D.2504: 30

1964 6d D.2501: 30

1964 6d D.2502: 0

1962 2/6 D.2329: 25

1962 2/6 D.2330: 0

1962 2/6 D.2331: 1

1962 2/6 D.2332: 4

1959 1/S Groom Type 1: 11

1959 1/S Groom Type 2: 18

1956 1/E D.2413: 9

1959 1/S D.2414: 9

1956 ½d F.471: 6

1956 ½d F.473: 0

1956 ½d F.474: 0

1956 ½d F.475: 0

1955 6d D.2491: 5

1955 6d D.2492: 23

1955 1/S D.2451/2: 3

1955 1/S D.2453: 10

1954 ½d F.466: 3

1956 ½d F.468: 1

1953 5/- D.2280: 7

1953 5/- D.2281: 4

1953 6d D.2480: 31

1953 6d D.2481: 2

1953 3d Obv 1: 23

1953 3d Obv 2: 1

1953 2/6 D.2310: 35

1953 2/6 D.2311: 1

1953 2/- D.2360: 24

1953 2/- D.2361: 0

1953 1/S D.2440: 34

1953 1/S D.2441: 3

1953 1/E D.2400: 29

1953 1/E D.2401: 2

1953 ½d F.463: 25

1953 ½d F.464: 1

1953 ¼d F.660: 18

1953 ¼d F.661: 2

1953 ¼d F.662: 0

1953 ¼d F.663: 29

1946 1/E D.2120: 26

1946 1/E D.2121: 1

1944 1d Groom 2+C: 6

1944 1d Groom 2+C1: 1

1940 ½d F.435: 0

1940 ½d F.437: 0

1940 ½d F.438: 4

1937 3dNB B to corner: 6

1937 3dNB B to right of corner: 31

1937 3dAg D.2230: 15

1937 3dAg D.2231: 0

1937 2/- D.2070: 16

1937 2/- D.2071: 0

1937 1d F.217: 13

1937 1d F.219: 14

1937 1d F.221: 2

1929 2/6 D.1704: 9

1929 2/6 D.1705: 1

1928 2/6 D.1701/2: 8

1928 2/6 D.1703: 2

1925 6d D.1879: 2

1925 6d D.1880: 14

1923 2/- D.1751: 8

1923 2/- D.1752: 0

1922 2/6 D.1680/1: 3

1922 2/6 D.1682/3: 5

1921 2/6 D.1677: 0

1921 2/6 D.1678: 9

1921 2/6 D.1679: 0

1921 1d F.190: 8

1921 1d F.191: 15

1921 1/- D.1805: 0

1921 1/- D.1806: 2

1921 1/- D.1807: 1

1921 1/- D.1808: 0

1921 1/- D.1809: 7

1920 2/6 D.1672: 9

1920 2/6 D.1673: 1

1920 2/6 D.1674: 0

1920 2/6 D.1675: 0

1920 2/6 D.1676: 0

1920 2/- D.1744: 5

1920 2/- D.1745: 1

1920 2/- D.1746: 5

1920 1/- D.1803: 13

1921 1/- D.1804: 2

1916 1d Normal ear: 8

1916 1d Recessed ear: 1

1915 1d Normal ear: 6

1915 1d Recessed ear: 0

1915 ¼d F.593A: 0

1915 ¼d F.594: 7

1914 3d D.1926: 1

1914 3d D.1927: 7

1914 2/- D.1735: 0

1914 2/- D.1736: 0

1914 2/- D.1737: 10

1914 ¼d F.592: 3

1914 ¼d F.593: 4

1913 1d F.174: 2

1913 1d F.175: 1

1913 1d F.176: 0

1913 1d F.177: 10

1912 1/- D.1794: 1

1912 1/- D.1795: 3

1912 ½d Groom Rev A: 6

1912 ½d Groom Rev A*: 0

1911 6d D.1860: 0

1911 6d D.1861: 0

1911 6d D.1862 Groom Rev A1: 0

1911 6d D.1862 Groom Rev A2: 0

1911 6d D.1863: 5

1911 3d D.1920: 4

1911 3d D.1921: 1

1911 3d D.1922: 0

1911 3d D.1923: 0

1911 2/- D.1730: 2

1911 2/- D.1731: 0

1911 1/- D.1790: 1

1911 1/- D.1791: 7

1911 1/- D.1792: 2

1911 ½d Groom 1+A: 3

1911 ½d Groom 1+A*: 2

1911 ½d Groom 1*+A: 5

1911 ½d Groom 1*+A*: 2

1911 ¼d Flat neck: 2

1911 ¼d Hollow neck: 1

1909 1d F.168: 4

1909 1d F.169: 0

1908 1d F.164: 0

1908 1d F.164A: 0

1908 1d F.165: 0

1908 1d F.166: 7

1906 3d D.1598: 2

1906 3d D.1599: 1

1906 1/- Groom 1+A: 1

1906 1/- Groom 2+A: 0

1906 1/- Groom 2a+A: 2

1905 3d D.1596: 0

1905 3d D.1597: 4

1905 1d F.160: 1

1905 1d F.161: 4

1904 1/- Groom 1+A: 0

1904 1/- Groom 2+A: 3

1904 1/- Groom 2a+A: 0

1904 3d D.1592: 1

1904 3d D.1593: 0

1904 3d D.1594: 1

1904 3d D.1595: 0

1903 1/- Groom 1+A: 0

1903 1/- Groom 2a+A: 1

I'm quite happy to collate if anyone else fancies contributing more numbers. I have the numbers for the more well known varieties too.

I doubt any of you lot have bought from me, so we shouldn't count the same coins twice anywhere...

interpretation welcome...

[argentumandcoins 70]

I'd like to help Declan but I have enough trouble trying to keep on top of my accounts never mind trying to report on what I have sold.

I can tell you that the rarer coins are few and far between though. I view thousands of coins every year and seldom come across many of the types mentioned (I don't however take any notice of anything post 1922 unless it is the 1956 1/2d or 1953 proof coinage).

Of the 1956 halfpennies I have only found 1 F474 (sold years ago to a member of the forum), 1 F473 and 2 F475, although the old man did buy a lot recently with all of the coins in it via auction.

[Peckris 579]

Well, luckily, I still have scans of most of the coins that have passed through my hands over the last 5 years, so here's a straw poll of some of these. It's not quite V.R. Court in terms of sample size, but you get the idea...

1967 ½d Normal rim: 21

1967 ½d Wide rim: 7

1965 6d D.2503: 0

1965 6d D.2504: 30

1964 6d D.2501: 30

1964 6d D.2502: 0

1962 2/6 D.2329: 25

1962 2/6 D.2330: 0

1962 2/6 D.2331: 1

1962 2/6 D.2332: 4

1959 1/S Groom Type 1: 11

1959 1/S Groom Type 2: 18

1956 1/E D.2413: 9

1959 1/S D.2414: 9

1956 ½d F.471: 6

1956 ½d F.473: 0

1956 ½d F.474: 0

1956 ½d F.475: 0

1955 6d D.2491: 5

1955 6d D.2492: 23

1955 1/S D.2451/2: 3

1955 1/S D.2453: 10

1954 ½d F.466: 3

1956 ½d F.468: 1

1953 5/- D.2280: 7

1953 5/- D.2281: 4

1953 6d D.2480: 31

1953 6d D.2481: 2

1953 3d Obv 1: 23

1953 3d Obv 2: 1

1953 2/6 D.2310: 35

1953 2/6 D.2311: 1

1953 2/- D.2360: 24

1953 2/- D.2361: 0

1953 1/S D.2440: 34

1953 1/S D.2441: 3

1953 1/E D.2400: 29

1953 1/E D.2401: 2

1953 ½d F.463: 25

1953 ½d F.464: 1

1953 ¼d F.660: 18

1953 ¼d F.661: 2

1953 ¼d F.662: 0

1953 ¼d F.663: 29

1946 1/E D.2120: 26

1946 1/E D.2121: 1

1944 1d Groom 2+C: 6

1944 1d Groom 2+C1: 1

1940 ½d F.435: 0

1940 ½d F.437: 0

1940 ½d F.438: 4

1937 3dNB B to corner: 6

1937 3dNB B to right of corner: 31

1937 3dAg D.2230: 15

1937 3dAg D.2231: 0

1937 2/- D.2070: 16

1937 2/- D.2071: 0

1937 1d F.217: 13

1937 1d F.219: 14

1937 1d F.221: 2

1929 2/6 D.1704: 9

1929 2/6 D.1705: 1

1928 2/6 D.1701/2: 8

1928 2/6 D.1703: 2

1925 6d D.1879: 2

1925 6d D.1880: 14

1923 2/- D.1751: 8

1923 2/- D.1752: 0

1922 2/6 D.1680/1: 3

1922 2/6 D.1682/3: 5

1921 2/6 D.1677: 0

1921 2/6 D.1678: 9

1921 2/6 D.1679: 0

1921 1d F.190: 8

1921 1d F.191: 15

1921 1/- D.1805: 0

1921 1/- D.1806: 2

1921 1/- D.1807: 1

1921 1/- D.1808: 0

1921 1/- D.1809: 7

1920 2/6 D.1672: 9

1920 2/6 D.1673: 1

1920 2/6 D.1674: 0

1920 2/6 D.1675: 0

1920 2/6 D.1676: 0

1920 2/- D.1744: 5

1920 2/- D.1745: 1

1920 2/- D.1746: 5

1920 1/- D.1803: 13

1921 1/- D.1804: 2

1916 1d Normal ear: 8

1916 1d Recessed ear: 1

1915 1d Normal ear: 6

1915 1d Recessed ear: 0

1915 ¼d F.593A: 0

1915 ¼d F.594: 7

1914 3d D.1926: 1

1914 3d D.1927: 7

1914 2/- D.1735: 0

1914 2/- D.1736: 0

1914 2/- D.1737: 10

1914 ¼d F.592: 3

1914 ¼d F.593: 4

1913 1d F.174: 2

1913 1d F.175: 1

1913 1d F.176: 0

1913 1d F.177: 10

1912 1/- D.1794: 1

1912 1/- D.1795: 3

1912 ½d Groom Rev A: 6

1912 ½d Groom Rev A*: 0

1911 6d D.1860: 0

1911 6d D.1861: 0

1911 6d D.1862 Groom Rev A1: 0

1911 6d D.1862 Groom Rev A2: 0

1911 6d D.1863: 5

1911 3d D.1920: 4

1911 3d D.1921: 1

1911 3d D.1922: 0

1911 3d D.1923: 0

1911 2/- D.1730: 2

1911 2/- D.1731: 0

1911 1/- D.1790: 1

1911 1/- D.1791: 7

1911 1/- D.1792: 2

1911 ½d Groom 1+A: 3

1911 ½d Groom 1+A*: 2

1911 ½d Groom 1*+A: 5

1911 ½d Groom 1*+A*: 2

1911 ¼d Flat neck: 2

1911 ¼d Hollow neck: 1

1909 1d F.168: 4

1909 1d F.169: 0

1908 1d F.164: 0

1908 1d F.164A: 0

1908 1d F.165: 0

1908 1d F.166: 7

1906 3d D.1598: 2

1906 3d D.1599: 1

1906 1/- Groom 1+A: 1

1906 1/- Groom 2+A: 0

1906 1/- Groom 2a+A: 2

1905 3d D.1596: 0

1905 3d D.1597: 4

1905 1d F.160: 1

1905 1d F.161: 4

1904 1/- Groom 1+A: 0

1904 1/- Groom 2+A: 3

1904 1/- Groom 2a+A: 0

1904 3d D.1592: 1

1904 3d D.1593: 0

1904 3d D.1594: 1

1904 3d D.1595: 0

1903 1/- Groom 1+A: 0

1903 1/- Groom 2a+A: 1

I'm quite happy to collate if anyone else fancies contributing more numbers. I have the numbers for the more well known varieties too.

I doubt any of you lot have bought from me, so we shouldn't count the same coins twice anywhere...

interpretation welcome...

My first reaction is to wonder why the first type of 1953 coins so absolutely & overwhlemingly outnumber the 2nd type. The answer must be the breakup of the plastic sets, which are exclusively the first type. Makes you wonder just how many of the sets remain (especially when you factor in the number of 1953 penny - only from sets - singletons that are/have been for sale).

Mind you, the plastic sets are still commonly available so even with a large scale breakup ratio, there are still plenty left.

[declanwmagee 122]

Yes - the older references (Peck, for instance), reckon the Obverse 1's are scarcer than the 2s, but it's definitely the other way around now. After a few months of looking properly, I only have the 2/- Obverse 2 to find, so neither are that difficult. Crowns, not being from the sets, are broadly similar in occurrence between Obv 1 and Obv 2.

There's 1.3m Pennies, so 1.3m plastic sets. To be honest, the plastic sets are such horrible greasy PVC I say break 'em out. We're coin collectors after all, not plastic collectors.

The other ones that jumped out at me when I was doing it:

1937 pennies. Freeman had them down as all roughly similar scarcity, but F221 trails well behind.

1925 6d: broad rim much commoner

Recessed ear pennies. CCGB says whack 20% on for recessed ear - I say whack a bit more than that on.

[argentumandcoins 70]

Yes - the older references (Peck, for instance), reckon the Obverse 1's are scarcer than the 2s, but it's definitely the other way around now. After a few months of looking properly, I only have the 2/- Obverse 2 to find, so neither are that difficult. Crowns, not being from the sets, are broadly similar in occurrence between Obv 1 and Obv 2.

There's 1.3m Pennies, so 1.3m plastic sets. To be honest, the plastic sets are such horrible greasy PVC I say break 'em out. We're coin collectors after all, not plastic collectors.

The other ones that jumped out at me when I was doing it:

1937 pennies. Freeman had them down as all roughly similar scarcity, but F221 trails well behind.

1925 6d: broad rim much commoner

Recessed ear pennies. CCGB says whack 20% on for recessed ear - I say whack a bit more than that on.

I just had a 1916 go off crapbay tonight unsold at 0.99p!

low grade but good enough as a gap filler.