Charles I VI Opinions Please?

[Coinery 1,157]

Could I ask opinions on this coin re its class/pedigree and grade?

310428456958 (again a proper link would be appreciated)!

Edited September 9, 2012 by Coinery

[Paulus 1,975]

Could I ask opinions on this coin re its class/pedigree and grade?

310428456958 (again a proper link would be appreciated)!

Link is below, unfortunately I am a complete ignoramus with hammered!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/310428456958;jsessionid=6B5C0D362A065BDC8F6587867AF32071?ru=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fsch%2Fi.html%3F_sacat%3D0%26_nkw%3D310428456958%26_rdc%3D1

[Coinery 1,157]

Could I ask opinions on this coin re its class/pedigree and grade?

310428456958 (again a proper link would be appreciated)!

Link is below, unfortunately I am a complete ignoramus with hammered!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/310428456958;jsessionid=6B5C0D362A065BDC8F6587867AF32071?ru=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fsch%2Fi.html%3F_sacat%3D0%26_nkw%3D310428456958%26_rdc%3D1

Thanks, Paulus, very much appreciated! I think it magnificent, had the magic factor for me, would love to know more about its finer points!

[TomGoodheart 403]

Group D, (Fourth bust) North 2240, Francis 3, Hawkins 3.

This coin is ex Brooker (604), R Carlyon-Britton (307) so a decent coin and nice provenance. Which explains the final price.

I'd grade it at nVF, but though sixpences aren't my area I suspect it's in better than average condition, being on a nice full flan with some good detail and as Stuart says, eye appeal. So strictly the grade isn't so important.

A better than normal example with that history? I'd say someone got a good deal.

.

Edited September 9, 2012 by TomGoodheart

[Coinery 1,157]

Group D, (Fourth bust) North 2240, Francis 3, Hawkins 3.

This coin is ex Brooker (604), R Carlyon-Britton (307) so a decent coin and nice provenance. Which explains the final price.

I'd grade it at nVF, but though sixpences aren't my area I suspect it's in better than average condition, being on a nice full flan with some good detail and as Stuart says, eye appeal. So strictly the grade isn't so important.

A better than normal example with some history? I'd say someone got a good deal.

Thanks, Richard, where did you get the provenance from? Does this dealer have a website? I came second, such a pretty coin!

[Rob 3,152]

Sixpences are probably the most difficult denomination to get in decent grade on account of the fact that they weren't normally hoarded to the extent of shillings and halfcrowns. A quality 6d is always worth buying. I'll have to dig out any provenance.

Oops, too late. I started this reply over an hour ago.

Edited September 9, 2012 by Rob

[Coinery 1,157]

Sixpences are probably the most difficult denomination to get in decent grade on account of the fact that they weren't normally hoarded to the extent of shillings and halfcrowns. A quality 6d is always worth buying. I'll have to dig out any provenance.

Oops, too late. I started this reply over an hour ago.

Thanks anyway, Rob! As Richard said, a good buy for someone!

[TomGoodheart 403]

Thanks, Richard, where did you get the provenance from? Does this dealer have a website? I came second, such a pretty coin!

I was lucky. The listing mentioned it was from "an important collection of English coins" so I did an auction search but didn't see anything recent. The Bole collection of sixpences was next (the DNW listing is still online) and when that turned up nothing, on a whim I looked in Brooker (Coins of Charles I, The John Brooker Collection, volume 33 of the Syllogue of Coins of the British Isles, by J.J. North & P.J. Preston-Morley, London 1984) and there it was with the provenance above.

Where it's been since the Brooker coins were sold I don't know. Maybe Rob might be able to track it?

As to the dealer, I've seen his ebay listings before, but don't know anything about him I'm afraid.

[Rob 3,152]

Thanks, Richard, where did you get the provenance from? Does this dealer have a website? I came second, such a pretty coin!

I was lucky. The listing mentioned it was from "an important collection of English coins" so I did an auction search but didn't see anything recent. The Bole collection of sixpences was next (the DNW listing is still online) and when that turned up nothing, on a whim I looked in Brooker (Coins of Charles I, The John Brooker Collection, volume 33 of the Syllogue of Coins of the British Isles, by J.J. North & P.J. Preston-Morley, London 1984) and there it was with the provenance above.

Where it's been since the Brooker coins were sold I don't know. Maybe Rob might be able to track it?

As to the dealer, I've seen his ebay listings before, but don't know anything about him I'm afraid.

Andy Holds has a sensible grip on munismatics and is ok. I was chatting to him yesterday at the Midland. I've known him since St.James's 3 (2005) when he bought a pattern halfpenny because I was asleep and I had to buy it post-sale from him.

[Coinery 1,157]

Thanks, Richard, where did you get the provenance from? Does this dealer have a website? I came second, such a pretty coin!

I was lucky. The listing mentioned it was from "an important collection of English coins" so I did an auction search but didn't see anything recent. The Bole collection of sixpences was next (the DNW listing is still online) and when that turned up nothing, on a whim I looked in Brooker (Coins of Charles I, The John Brooker Collection, volume 33 of the Syllogue of Coins of the British Isles, by J.J. North & P.J. Preston-Morley, London 1984) and there it was with the provenance above.

Where it's been since the Brooker coins were sold I don't know. Maybe Rob might be able to track it?

As to the dealer, I've seen his ebay listings before, but don't know anything about him I'm afraid.

Andy Holds has a sensible grip on munismatics and is ok. I was chatting to him yesterday at the Midland. I've known him since St.James's 3 (2005) when he bought a pattern halfpenny because I was asleep and I had to buy it post-sale from him.

Thanks again! I wish I'd sniped with more, though lord knows what the other guy was prepared to go to? I guess with the recent heritage accompanying the coin I should have done better!

I've got a real problem developing, in that I find far too many coins attractive. Can be absolutely anything, G5, Celtic, Roman...I think gold, copper, silver and tin, can all look staggeringly beautiful when right!

I guess it's possible to have a generic collection, with quality the criterion instead of cohesion? It just presently spreads the knowledge base a tad too far, unfortunately.

A collection of 100 or so coins, each with wow factor, and related to each other only by country of origin might be the only solution!

Tsk, wish I never got involved sometimes!

[TomGoodheart 403]

Thanks again! I wish I'd sniped with more, though lord knows what the other guy was prepared to go to? I guess with the recent heritage accompanying the coin I should have done better!

I've got a real problem developing, in that I find far too many coins attractive. Can be absolutely anything, G5, Celtic, Roman...I think gold, copper, silver and tin, can all look staggeringly beautiful when right!

I guess it's possible to have a generic collection, with quality the criterion instead of cohesion? It just presently spreads the knowledge base a tad too far, unfortunately.

A collection of 100 or so coins, each with wow factor, and related to each other only by country of origin might be the only solution!

Tsk, wish I never got involved sometimes!

LOL Nothing wrong with a diverse collection if that's what appeals. I think Rob's is based on examples from each monarch, but not restricted to particular denominations. And if you can afford to buy quality then I'm sure you'll enjoy your coins and it will ensure a better chance for a reasonable return if you ever wish to sell.

In the end there is no right or wrong way to collect. Though obviously I'd recommend doing so in a way that preserves the coins so having the all mounted as jewellery or stuck to a board with araldite wouldn't be my choice. Me, I balance my likes with my limited budget. Plus I prefer my coin trays the same size! But how you collect is .. up to you, as long as you enjoy it and don't have to do anything illegal to fund it!

As to sniping this coin, well, there is an advantage to collecting a limited range because it's a bit easier to have a handle on prices and availability. Particularly when your memory is failing like mine! I just checked. I have over 1100 photos of Charles I shillings with the price that was paid for them, where they sold and when, plus any other useful info. It's a brilliant resource, but if I did that for all denominations, or more than one monarch, I'd .. probably be on the laptop even more of my life than I am now!

However the old addage, 'it's what you've not seen (in terms of coin design, type or grade) rather than what you have seen that matters' is still a good rule of thumb, whatever you collect, I reckon.

Edited September 10, 2012 by TomGoodheart

[Rob 3,152]

Thanks again! I wish I'd sniped with more, though lord knows what the other guy was prepared to go to? I guess with the recent heritage accompanying the coin I should have done better!

I've got a real problem developing, in that I find far too many coins attractive. Can be absolutely anything, G5, Celtic, Roman...I think gold, copper, silver and tin, can all look staggeringly beautiful when right!

I guess it's possible to have a generic collection, with quality the criterion instead of cohesion? It just presently spreads the knowledge base a tad too far, unfortunately.

A collection of 100 or so coins, each with wow factor, and related to each other only by country of origin might be the only solution!

Tsk, wish I never got involved sometimes!

LOL Nothing wrong with a diverse collection if that's what appeals. I think Rob's is based on examples from each monarch, but not restricted to particular denominations. And if you can afford to buy quality then I'm sure you'll enjoy your coins and it will ensure a better chance for a reasonable return if you ever wish to sell.

In the end there is no right or wrong way to collect. Though obviously I'd recommend doing so in a way that preserves the coins so having the all mounted as jewellery or stuck to a board with araldite wouldn't be my choice. Me, I balance my likes with my limited budget. Plus I prefer my coin trays the same size! But how you collect is .. up to you, as long as you enjoy it and don't have to do anything illegal to fund it!

Including an example of each 'Person in whose name the coin was struck' including the episcopal issues, Denomination, Metal type including various finesses, Metal provenance, Minting processes, Minting features, errors/faults, Attributed designer's work, Initial or privy mark, Mint location, Type example (where not otherwise included) and finally, the very important Too Nice to Sell. I try to avoid duplication of the above criteria where possible, though usually fail miserably when the last one is invoked. I have many gaps.

[azda 979]

Thanks, Richard, where did you get the provenance from? Does this dealer have a website? I came second, such a pretty coin!

I was lucky. The listing mentioned it was from "an important collection of English coins" so I did an auction search but didn't see anything recent. The Bole collection of sixpences was next (the DNW listing is still online) and when that turned up nothing, on a whim I looked in Brooker (Coins of Charles I, The John Brooker Collection, volume 33 of the Syllogue of Coins of the British Isles, by J.J. North & P.J. Preston-Morley, London 1984) and there it was with the provenance above.

Where it's been since the Brooker coins were sold I don't know. Maybe Rob might be able to track it?

As to the dealer, I've seen his ebay listings before, but don't know anything about him I'm afraid.

Andy Holds has a sensible grip on munismatics and is ok. I was chatting to him yesterday at the Midland. I've known him since St.James's 3 (2005) when he bought a pattern halfpenny because I was asleep and I had to buy it post-sale from him.

I had a run in with said Mr Holds about 2 years back when i sold him in auction an 1820 Closed 2 variety Sov. I posted it after he's paid etc and when it did'nt arrive to him in good time he got a little snotty (not that i deliver it to him)

A few emails here and there then he opened a dispute then told me i'd better kiss his ass if i did'nt want a negative which he gave me anyway and he got his coin. P***k in my eyes.

[Rob 3,152]

Thanks, Richard, where did you get the provenance from? Does this dealer have a website? I came second, such a pretty coin!

I was lucky. The listing mentioned it was from "an important collection of English coins" so I did an auction search but didn't see anything recent. The Bole collection of sixpences was next (the DNW listing is still online) and when that turned up nothing, on a whim I looked in Brooker (Coins of Charles I, The John Brooker Collection, volume 33 of the Syllogue of Coins of the British Isles, by J.J. North & P.J. Preston-Morley, London 1984) and there it was with the provenance above.

Where it's been since the Brooker coins were sold I don't know. Maybe Rob might be able to track it?

As to the dealer, I've seen his ebay listings before, but don't know anything about him I'm afraid.

Andy Holds has a sensible grip on munismatics and is ok. I was chatting to him yesterday at the Midland. I've known him since St.James's 3 (2005) when he bought a pattern halfpenny because I was asleep and I had to buy it post-sale from him.

I had a run in with said Mr Holds about 2 years back when i sold him in auction an 1820 Closed 2 variety Sov. I posted it after he's paid etc and when it did'nt arrive to him in good time he got a little snotty (not that i deliver it to him)

A few emails here and there then he opened a dispute then told me i'd better kiss his ass if i did'nt want a negative which he gave me anyway and he got his coin. P***k in my eyes.

Oh well, disagreement here then.

[azda 979]

Only with him Rob, we all have Our own opinions, and that was a first hand account of him. In reflection i should have got eBay to retract his FB on account of blackmail but its done and dusted now, although he did bid on something of mine recently and i sent him to the block list.

[Rob 3,152]

Only with him Rob, we all have Our own opinions, and that was a first hand account of him. In reflection i should have got eBay to retract his FB on account of blackmail but its done and dusted now, although he did bid on something of mine recently and i sent him to the block list.

Can't help wondering if this is part of that strange phenomemon associated with the internet where people seem to get overly aggressive and abusive at a distance, yet are mild mannered face to face. Forums are littered with such examples. On the PCGS forum the world coins section is always praised for being a haven of civility, whereas the US section is usually mentioned for being its antithesis.

[Coinery 1,157]

Only with him Rob, we all have Our own opinions, and that was a first hand account of him. In reflection i should have got eBay to retract his FB on account of blackmail but its done and dusted now, although he did bid on something of mine recently and i sent him to the block list.

Can't help wondering if this is part of that strange phenomemon associated with the internet where people seem to get overly aggressive and abusive at a distance, yet are mild mannered face to face. Forums are littered with such examples. On the PCGS forum the world coins section is always praised for being a haven of civility, whereas the US section is usually mentioned for being its antithesis.

I don't mean to bring cars back to the table, but I think the above phenomenon is well documented in many activities of life!

When I was a young cockerel I once indicated to pull in to the left about 20 yards or so before a turning, which caught the driver out behind, who 'assumed' I'd be travelling on a little further and turning OFF the road. The driver of the other car, who wasn't paying enough attention, slammed on his brakes and then must have punched his horn through the back of his steering wheel, where he held it there for a good 5 seconds. In my rear-view mirror I noticed his arms flailing around and his mouth wide open, exhalting things I care not to think about.

My blood was up now, and I leapt out the car...to find the driver was the local vicar; a kinder, more gentle man, you could not hope to find! THE END!

[Peckris 579]

Only with him Rob, we all have Our own opinions, and that was a first hand account of him. In reflection i should have got eBay to retract his FB on account of blackmail but its done and dusted now, although he did bid on something of mine recently and i sent him to the block list.

Can't help wondering if this is part of that strange phenomemon associated with the internet where people seem to get overly aggressive and abusive at a distance, yet are mild mannered face to face. Forums are littered with such examples. On the PCGS forum the world coins section is always praised for being a haven of civility, whereas the US section is usually mentioned for being its antithesis.

I think you're spot on, Rob. Trolls only have the courage of their own existence while hiding anonymously on the internet. But as you say, the UK coins world - this forum being a case in point - is a haven of civility. And long may it continue!

As for Dave's experience on eBay, I think that's one place where - due to the scary protection of buyers, and the now religiously-regarded feedback system - they almost encourage people to fall out. I loathe the charges incurred at bricks and mortar auction houses, but at least they are places of general politeness and civility compared to the 'Bay.

[azda 979]

I think the internet is a funny place for people with alter egos. I don't know Mr Holds personally but the manner in which he went about Things is not how i would have reacted personally. In the end the coin was in a PO Box which he did'nt Check and he gave me his verbal because of his failure to do so. Needless to say i did'nt kiss his ass and would'nt have done so anyway. Its life, we move on and ignore the idiots.

[azda 979]

EBay is certainly a haven to encourage blackmail Peck. I know we can all get a little annoyed at times here and disagree on things, but we are civil enough to take the banter two and move on.

[Peter 615]

Only with him Rob, we all have Our own opinions, and that was a first hand account of him. In reflection i should have got eBay to retract his FB on account of blackmail but its done and dusted now, although he did bid on something of mine recently and i sent him to the block list.

Can't help wondering if this is part of that strange phenomemon associated with the internet where people seem to get overly aggressive and abusive at a distance, yet are mild mannered face to face. Forums are littered with such examples. On the PCGS forum the world coins section is always praised for being a haven of civility, whereas the US section is usually mentioned for being its antithesis.

There was road rage and now internet rage.

It is easy to get angry...I do make an effort to chill....has your partner ever tried to argue?I just say I love you and I'm so lucky to be with you...now make me a cuppa.

Edited September 10, 2012 by Peter

[Rob 3,152]

EBay is certainly a haven to encourage blackmail Peck. I know we can all get a little annoyed at times here and disagree on things, but we are civil enough to take the banter two and move on.

It's banter one that causes all the grief.

[Peckris 579]

I think the internet is a funny place for people with alter egos. I don't know Mr Holds personally but the manner in which he went about Things is not how i would have reacted personally. In the end the coin was in a PO Box which he did'nt Check and he gave me his verbal because of his failure to do so. Needless to say i did'nt kiss his ass and would'nt have done so anyway. Its life, we move on and ignore the idiots.

To right!

[Coinery 1,157]

I think the internet is a funny place for people with alter egos. I don't know Mr Holds personally but the manner in which he went about Things is not how i would have reacted personally. In the end the coin was in a PO Box which he did'nt Check and he gave me his verbal because of his failure to do so. Needless to say i did'nt kiss his ass and would'nt have done so anyway. Its life, we move on and ignore the idiots.

To right!

Your right, there!

[azda 979]

I think the internet is a funny place for people with alter egos. I don't know Mr Holds personally but the manner in which he went about Things is not how i would have reacted personally. In the end the coin was in a PO Box which he did'nt Check and he gave me his verbal because of his failure to do so. Needless to say i did'nt kiss his ass and would'nt have done so anyway. Its life, we move on and ignore the idiots.

To right!

Your right, there!

It was a nice coin too