Shocking Experience from CGS - Coin Grading Services - Forum Advice Pl

[futurama.shopuk 0]

Hi All,

I must start by saying I never thought I would have to write this story or even publish it in the public domain. Sadly however my arm has been twisted and I feel it only right that I tell other collectors about the shocking service received by the team at CGS (UK Grading).

My story starts back in April 2014, with a phone call from a friend. “I have found some treasure I’d like you to look at!”. I have bought and sold items for many years and have know issue helping friends and local people in selling items. My friend however is should we say a bit eccentric to put it a polite. His normal ‘treasure’ is a box of junk and I have the unpleasant task of telling him its worthless.

So I met my friend at the local Working Men’s Social club, with the expectation to be met with a box of vintage toys, an old book or some other random item. On this occasion to my surprise he pulled a small bag from his wallet. One of the little bags you use in your washing machine. My friend by trade is a gardener and odd job man never having much money. Inside the bag was a coin, intrigued I asked where he had found this coin. It was found in an elderly customers garden while doing some digging, the elderly gent had told my friend he could keep the coin.

The normal question popped up “what’s it worth and can you sell it for me”. I have dealt it vintage toys for years and enjoy the mystery of finding out heritage and value etc. I have a one rule when selling something, I must ensure it is real whatever it is, I don’t want to damage my reputation or upset a customer. Coins I must admit are not my strong point, the only dealings I have is day to day use. All I could tell is it looked old and it had been in the ground for a number of years. A quick Google search and I guessed it was a Groat of some sort.

For the past ten years I have been a fan in the toy world of grading, it ensures the toys are protected and gives the buyer reassurance that what they are purchasing is the real deal. It also gives an indication of quality. I suggested to my friend that he should get the coin graded before we do anything as I don’t really have a clue. He intrusted the coin to me and I started my research.

I came across a company in the UK called CGS based in Kent. The website looked very professional and they seemed to tick all the boxes. I started by contacting the company for advice and in due course I was contacted back by Semra Cetin who advises she is the General Manager. At the start Semra was very helpful and advised that CGS could help and I should send in the coin. A bit perplexed by the submission form I enquired if I could leave areas blank I needed help with. The main part being what kind of coin it was and which category it should fit into.

In my experience of submitting toys for grading again they use a tier system. Grading is based on ‘risk and reward’ more vintage the item the likelihood is it will return a higher reward. In the past if I have submitted a toy in say a lower category in error I would receive an email advising of this and increasing the grading value. This also in the past working the other way around, if submitting a figure in a higher category in error it would be highlighted and the price changed. Sort of basic customer service you would expect.

Anyway back to the coin grading. As suggested the coin was packed and sent special delivery at a cost of £9 to ensure its safe passage. A few days later I received my invoice from Semra requesting payment for £39.99. The breakdown being, hammered and ancient category £29.99 with £10 return postage. I duly responded with payment method and soon advised that my coin would be sent back the next day.

The next email was my final invoice with the following statement “Your coin in invoice INV02516 has been graded and encapsulated”.

All sounds good to now and I was amazed at the speed of service. Excited to see what grade our garden find had achieved I contacted Semra for the details. The grade was ‘unauthenticated’? Your at this point probably scratching your head the same as I was, how could they have graded and encapsulated a coin they couldn’t authenticate. Stumped I emailed Semra again for more information for the blunt response of “It’s a forgery”.

I received the coin back loose and not encapsulated as advised and a letter advising that the garden find was in fact a modern coin made to represent an old coin.

So as you would expect I emailed the company to enquire about the charge of £39.99. I understand grading and peoples time is not free. I wanted to question how they could charge me a category 3 price when they have clearly stated it is a modern coin which is category 1? More to the point the invoice advised the coin had been encapsulated which it hadn’t. So based on these basic facts I requested a partial refund of £21.23.

This was rejected on the basis that they do not have the ability to process refunds? Based on this I was offered my next grading free of charge. As I mentioned at the start I am by know means a coin collector so this resolution had little value to me.

This resolution is why I have kept my story and frustration to myself for such a long time, in the knowing that if I ever need a coin grading again I have the offer of a free service.

Come forward to May this year and another meeting in the Social Club with another friend. “what do you think of this”. As she produced a 20p, luckily I remember in 2009 the Royal Mint in error produced a number of 20p without a date. That was one of these rare coins. I was asked as normal what should I do with it, the biggest fear being a modern coin was someone mistaking it as change and it being used. With gritted teeth I suggested having the coin graded.

Remembering Semra’s offer of a free service as resolution I contacted CGS to ask how they would like the coin submitted. This email was ignored.

After a few days my friend asked if she could just send it, to which I duly helped complete the forms and send the coin in all her details. A few days passed, after the coin showed signed for to which she emailed to enquire if the coin had been received. This again was read and ignored by CGS. So a few more days later she called to enquire. “I’ll have a look and ring you back later, what’s your number”.

Well that call didn’t happen so she called again. “I’ll have a look and call you later, what’s your number”. Again, yes you guessed the call didn’t happen. Third attempt and the same response. I ask if they had any intention of returning a call they would not ask for the number three times.

I must stress at this point the coin had been sent with completed paperwork with payment method duly included. She had the intention to pay for the service as we could not find out how to use my free service.

In frustration she turned to me for help. Feeling bad I emailed the company direct and as you can guess my email was ignored. I finally found an email address for the forum head a Mr Bill Pugsley, again I never expected a response but to my shock Bill contacted me straight away and advised he would speak to CGS staff face to face at his next meeting.

This next part will shock anyone who deals in the world of customer service or anyone who knows the difference between right and wrong. The coin 30 days later after sending has been returned. Not by CGS as you would expect but by Royal Mail. When they attempted to deliver the coin the representative of CGS checked the package and noted the address being the same village as me and rejected the delivery.

So every phone call of “I will check and get back to you” was a lie as he already knew the parcel was not with CGS as they had rejected it.

I can understand Semra being annoyed that I questioned the ethics of her company, but clearly she agreed an error had been made by offering a free service. But then to ignore the request to uphold this agreement it poor. Then to treat another customer poorly because of this is truly shocking. To date my friend has not had an explanation of to why her service was not completed. Her emails go un-responded to.

On both occasion I have tried to help people with joining the world of collecting and on both occasions have been treated shockingly by a company who should be encouraging collectors. They clearly don’t understand word of mouth is the true way to grow and business and help it be accepted in the world of collecting.

My only hope is someone will read this email before they part with their hard earned money to such a poorly run company. I feel sorry for Bill who is a true collector and gentleman. He puts his time into running a forum and trying in vain to protect its name and the values of coin collecting.

Thank you for taking the time to read this.

Andy

[Coinery 1,226]

Shocking! However, I'm intrigued to know how it is you know Bill?

Edited June 11, 2015 by Coinery

[futurama.shopuk 0]

Hi

In desperation I looked at the CGS website and found it had a forum. To joint the forum it advised to email Bill directly and it displayed his email. Sent him the details and he's spoken to the management. He's going to come back to me with his findings when he's back late this week or next week.

Andy

[Peter 615]

Bill has been on this forum many times and his honesty is without doubt.

Keep pegging away and I'm sure you will get a result.

BTW CGS are associated with London Coins.

[azda 981]

I really have no idea why this woman is still employed at CGS. Every complaint about it involves her and her f@¥$%#g apalling attitude towards people who pay her damn salary. I'm totally done with them after my coin comes back.

[Paulus 1,979]

Bill has been on this forum many times and his honesty is without doubt.

Keep pegging away and I'm sure you will get a result.

BTW CGS are associated with London Coins.

Indeed, and the meeting Bill was referring to would have been at the London Coins auction last weekend.

I use CGS myself from time to time, and have found them to be inefficient on occasion, but nothing like this!

[futurama.shopuk 0]

Hi All,

When I was doing some digging about the company it turns out Semra is actually the company owner and is listed on the Governments website Companies House.

Clearly she does not understand the power of 'word of mouth' we live in the digital age now, in the past giving bad service cascaded to around another ten people, in the modern world it's expected a bad experience can be cascaded to thousands using social media within minutes.

Companies need to ensure customer service is at its highest. They may not realise it but a company with high standards and low complaints is a great place to be and business will grow.

it would be helpful if anyone can advise on how I could get a single coin graded now? I'm based in the UK.

Thanks again

Andy

[Paulus 1,979]

If you can post decent pictures on here then I expect some of us collectors could grade it accurately

[azda 981]

Go through NGC or PCGS, probably more customer friendly

[futurama.shopuk 0]

I looked at PCGS and seems you need to be a member and submit a minimum of five coins. I'm not a collector so don't have lots of coins neither does my friend in trying to help.

Main reason for the grading on the 20p is to ensure its safety and ensure it doesn't get mixed up and spent.

[azda 981]

You can buy the plastic holders that CGS use on ebay. Look up this number on ebay

140874274011

Edited June 11, 2015 by azda

[Paulus 1,979]

I looked at PCGS and seems you need to be a member and submit a minimum of five coins. I'm not a collector so don't have lots of coins neither does my friend in trying to help.

Main reason for the grading on the 20p is to ensure its safety and ensure it doesn't get mixed up and spent.

Andy, I believe you can submit a single coin to PCGS through The London Coin Company (no connection with CGS!).

Here's the link:

http://thelondoncoincompany.com/WebRoot/Store10/Shops/4d237887-b78a-4f19-8c94-ebc46654c578/MediaGallery/2015_PCGS_Grading_Application_Form_GB_Pounds_June.pdf

However, you may find the cost of submission to be more than the coin is worth!

[Peter 615]

Put a picture up and if it is good we have many dealers who will grade it FOC

[Paulus 1,979]

Put a picture up and if it is good we have many dealers who will grade it FOC

Yep, and get a do-it-yourself slab from eBay so it won't get lost or spent

[Peter 615]

I reckon on a predecimal grading service would wipe out TPG's

Some of the rubbish out there is appalling.

Not interested in modern crap from the US.

[TomGoodheart 407]

Put a picture up and if it is good we have many dealers who will grade it FOC

Yep, and get a do-it-yourself slab from eBay so it won't get lost or spent

Good idea. I think in another recent thread it was mentioned that the price of undated 20ps had dropped from the original highs when their existence was first announced. The cost of having it graded and encapsulated is likely to equate to a fair proportion of the coin's value.

Better to get the views of members here about the grade for free. Unless it's absolutely pristine I think the self-slab would then be the best option. Or there are coin capsules that would protect it just as well ...

.

[Rob 3,204]

I looked at PCGS and seems you need to be a member and submit a minimum of five coins. I'm not a collector so don't have lots of coins neither does my friend in trying to help.

Main reason for the grading on the 20p is to ensure its safety and ensure it doesn't get mixed up and spent.

It isn't worth grading a £30 coin. There is at least 100,000 of the buggers out there. Just get a capsule and that will readily identify it as the one not to be spent.

[copper123 1,548]

This whole sorry tale leads me to the conclusion that the whole company is inept and should not exist with it's attitude to customers .

BREATHTAKINGLY USELESS

[azda 981]

When i sent my 1860 halfpeeny in with the grading price set at the lowest price due to what i paid i got an invoice 3 days after they got it with the higher amount.

I also emailed and said i'd only paid 60 euros forthe coin amd asked why they were charging me more, still waiting on the reply 25 days later.

I really dislike this womans atritude, she needs a good kick inthe arse, i pity the man whi's married to her.

[copper123 1,548]

Doubt very much she is married she sounds like a sexually repressed spinster to me

[azda 981]

Lol, you could be right

[Peter 615]

Dreadful really

I showed the owner at the Midland who accused my Colin Cooke collection farthing of having verdigris.

I still can't see it.

The bloke is a knob or blind.

These idiots grade coins to suit THEM.

Not interested in these cowboys.

[azda 981]

Its all about money Peter, the more they can drag a coin down the more profit there is for them

Edited June 12, 2015 by azda

[SWANNY 25]

I wish I had read this before I sent my crown to CGS. I have written a few emails to complain about the service I received, and did not get any reply

I won't be using CGS again for any of my coins......

[azda 981]

I wish I had read this before I sent my crown to CGS. I have written a few emails to complain about the service I received, and did not get any reply

I won't be using CGS again for any of my coins......

You won't get a reply because Semra is judge, jury and executioner, she's boss man. Now that you know it's a kosha gothic I'd send it to PCGS, you can use a middle man, maybe Alan from MHCOINS? Edited October 30, 2015 by azda